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If you've found someone willing to pay the Nominet fees on your behalf, then good luck to you both - I'd be examining the small-print very very carefully on that one.
Imho the shared webhosting is an evem bigger scam - 5$/month for 100mb space, 1gb traffic and no MySQL linux Cpanel hosting.
Noone in their right mind would buy a plan like that.
Its even sponsored by Nominet, BT and Google.
Yes, if you're looking at the XenServer based product range - it's limited to 7 people per host (as CPU cores are dedicated - in fact all resources are 100% dedicated)
- they're very much like mini dedicated servers - we call it Virtual Dedicated Servers because the cpu, ram, disk etc are all dedicated to that user.
We also have the OVZ based Virtual Private Server products - still no overselling, but it's "shared" cpu, number of vps per host is dependant on number of "units" ordered - maximum 63 vps, but most have less (ISTR the average is 39) because the ram tends to sell out before the cpu capability is ever reached.
Rob.
Have you EVER EVER EVER looked at the competitions prices and compared them to your own?
Actually the site says "Unmanaged Virtual Private Server
Linux Virtual Private Server"
Having seen the "sites" you can create with the GBBO system, and helped people get away from it - the £5 you're saving on a domain isn't worth the days you're wasting on trying to use the service.
And it's not sponsored by Nominet, the domains are handled by Yola a US based domain reseller.
They used to be done by BT and Nominet.
Linode is far cheaper then your VPSs, and they don't oversell and offer a high premium service.
Of course. We're 20% cheaper than Telecity for colo, 40% cheaper than Amazon for cloud, 10% cheaper than 123reg for domains, 30% cheaper than Hostway for VPS ...
Othello have 16 years experience of providing hosting, domains, servers, colo and related services - I'm very aware of what running those services costs, which is largely which dictates the pricing structures.
and have you ever looked at the competitions websites?
Hostway.com VPS U100:
256mb RAM, 25gb HDD, 1000gb
30$/month
othellovps.net VPS-LINUX-10:
256mb RAM, 10gb HDD, 100gb traffic
32$/month
Yep i see how you are 30% cheaper... Anyway no technical-savy person would buy a VPS with Hostway either.
Also how can you compare your prices to Amazon for the cloud? You don't even have cloud hosting the way Amazon has...
I like the linode system, and the manager is very slick, our cloud-server deployment system still needs a lot of polishing before it comes close to being as user friendly.
But they don't dedicate cores to each VPS, so it's not a valid comparison, as 100 VPS can be "sharing"the same CPU.
But Linode give you a fair share of 4, and I've never EVER had any speed issues with Linode.
They don't oversell at all, who cares about a dedicated CPU, an equal share of 4 Intel Xeons is going to be faster then then an Intel Atom.
They've taken all the non-virtuozzo systems off the website... interesting.
But a LOT of corporates do, and the majority of our client-base are SMEs, so we end up quoting against them a fair amount.
Why would anyone put an Atom anywhere near a server ? It's a chip designed for cheap netbooks.
People who need constant, reliable, definable cpu performance care about dedicated cpu - which is who the range is aimed at - business who want to replace their old dedicated server with a VDS - getting raid-10 disk, redundant psu, faster cpu - a fixed %age from 12.5% to 88% of a much bigger server.
I'll be the first to admit, our main product range doesn't fit with the typical LET poster - our clients requirements in a host/service are quite specific, and that's who the systems are designed around.
The only way I can see the LEB concept being viable is some combination of
My s/sheets say the system pays for itself at 93 people to a host - my brain tells me that's a lot of disappointed clients when the hardware goes bang, and my technical team just look horrified when I mention it at all ...
Got to give it to rob. He doesnt give in haha. But seriously your prices are too high. Even for the basics. Even cutting your VPS prices in half would be a start.
Question: Why do you buy LEB companies then?
Why don't you guys take this shitstorm elsewhere?
Huh?
It's not really about whether an organisation is an "LEB" or not, it's a combination of things like:
etc
Part of our overall business growth strategy is to acquire other business in the same areas as we operate - internet-services being primarily brownfield rather than greenfield - the basic logic being it's easier to get a registrant to renew a domain, than a non-registrant to register one.
In the main that means we look for 3yr+ established web hosts and domain registrars, with a preference given to ccTLD registry members (as it opens up new markets and extends the domain platforms), Cpanel/WHM hosts (as it's a trivial no-downtime migration) and those offering colo in the UK (as it fills our DC up).
But I also get involved in "rescues" where the provider would otherwise fail taking people offline - they're never ideal as there will always be integration and legacy issues to deal with, most are too-far-gone to warrant spending time on.
In terms of numbers, Othello looked into 452 companies in 2011, and acquired 6.
And we've examined 81 this year so far and acquired 3.
@Francisco @KuJoe @miTgiB What combination do you pick?
@othelloRob Until this post I thought that the Daniel/DanielM attitude was unjustified (you have different market targets, is understandable), now I'm starting to think that they was right. I found your post quite rude.
Likewise there are some who do more or less exactly what Rob mentioned, and have been accepted into the community. It's also worth noting that as the end user if you're buying VZ/OpenVZ you have little idea how oversold your node is.
So? As long as i can use the amount of RAM, HDD and network i'm paying for and the CPU is decent why should i care for overselling?
Because in most oversold setups, you can only get the resources you're "promised" if someone else isn't getting them - in other words they're subsidising your vps - so whilst you might get what you're promised, that's not the level of resources you're actually charged for.
It's all calculations of contention, ratios, usage ...
Quit the marketing doubletalk, you are so full of shit your eyes are brown I bet. A properly managed VPS node is oversold as that is the whole purpose of VPS, to increase and maximize the efficiency of your asset, i.e. hardware.
The choice of hardware, SAN or local disk, CPU model, design of drive, are all decided by what level of demand is needed by the applications to be run on the hardware.
Notice how I've never defined if this is a hosting company or enterprise corporation making these choices, as that part of the equation is irrelevant. Your failed argument is one size fits all, and those of us with real, actual, long term knowledge of providing technology know all too well, that is simply not realistic. The service many of us LEB providers offer are not meant for every use out there, and are quite overkill for many as well, but that does not mean we need to make completely overkill designs to meet absolutely every possible need either. That would be a poor business choice as well.
Actually, the client had to be notified as they now al have a new contractual partner they never had a previous contractual agreement with. As soon as the contractual partner changes you have the right to end the contract. Otherwise you would be put into an insolvency risk.
Rob, What is this discussion actually based around. We have already established that you cannot compete in the LEB Market and for your other remarks which are complete and utter bullshit.
I don't see what else you have to proove here. I already dispise you because my phone bill was through the roof this month but at the end of the day a High Spec VPS node is going to be better then some trashy Dual Core Proccessor.
Thanks, I guess.
I have to admit, some of my post towards Rob are just trolling
The purpose of Virtualisation is to abstract the hardware layer - it may mean you can run multiple "machines" on the same kit, it may simply be for standardised management/control.
Being a VPS node doesn't preclude or dictate overselling - that's a provider choice, not a technology choice.
I see a lot of "sole occupant" virtualised complete servers - are they not "properly managed" just because they only run 1 machine instance ?
It's a discussion, they go off on tangents ...
A high-spec node with 1000 VMs on it, is going to be as slow as the psion3 in my desk drawer - surely whether that's acceptable to the client depends on their expectations over what they were sold - which is what interests me - what do people really think they'll get for their sub £4/$7 service
i.e if the "cost" to provide the server, colo, bw, power, support, licences, etc was £400/month, would people accept 1/100th to 1/200th of the server capabilities ?
Is there a price-point are users are prepared to accept a provider waving their hands in the air going "it's all gone, what did you expect for just $??.??" when a HDD breaks or is at least RAID always a requirement...
etc.
@othelloRob
Now I'm not a designer Rob, but did anyone ever tell you your site looks like it was made by a 10 year old?
even http://tinyvz.com/ is better.
That is a deployment choice, and if a customer is willing to pay for it, why wouldn't I sell it. The main selling point of VPS for the past several years has been to maximize the efficiency of hardware and reduce data center costs while producing the same work, in other words, over commitment. I fear you do not fully understand the technology or are just so slick a snake oil salesman you can only speak in buzzwords.