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Tommorrow Finland electricity prices peaking at ~1.9€/KWh VAT 0%.
PulsedMedia
Member, Patron Provider
Energy crisis is not over. Summer spot pricing was cheap, back to normal for a few months.
Tomorrow peaks at ~1.9€/KWh, or about 100x what it should be.
Thankfully we went through the extraordinary effort to save on electricity consumption a year ago, otherwise tomorrow each hour (despite partially locked rates) would be insanely expensive. This is much beyond our worst expectations a year ago for electricity price, but it's fortunately just few hours peak.
Our electrical rates at lowest during this year was almost twice the normal rates prior to this. Usually much higher, about 2.5x on average than any year prior.
Since prices are usually locked in for a period or partially (depends on scale of your purchasing), the final price changes slower than spot pricing. For example many places lock 40% and 60% is spot priced.
People were asking .... no demanding, discounts the moment prices dropped in the spring, i remember this. So how about now that prices are peaking, should we 5x our pricing, is that acceptable? 
Here's couple services to check pricing in Finland:
https://sahkonhinta.xn--hlytyslista-l8a.fi/
https://www.vattenfall.fi/sahkosopimukset/porssisahko/tuntispot-hinnat-sahkoporssissa/
Will There Be Enough?? There's even talks that the grid may fail tomorrow, despite Olkiluoto 3 having been finished and at maximum allowed power level (It's capacity has been curtailed by Fingrid), and other new capacity finishing this year.
It looks like the more there is renewables, the more spotty and flaky the grid becomes 
For our Kerava DC we have been considering the option of adding several hours worth of battery capacity due to all these grid issues.
For example at 100kwh battery pack tomorrow we could charge it at 15cents/kWh (+ losses) and empty it at average of 180cents/kWh, making 165€ from that arbitrage alone!
This would at the same time provide in normal days plenty of battery backup. Today's arbitrage would be a "mere" 23€ and yestesday 7.9€.
100kwh costs about 30k € + inverters + installation + space it takes.
Arbitrage like this would allow the full system to be paid off in approximately 7 to 10 years, depending on cell quality. Add opportunity costs, building the automation, design etc. would probably add a year to pay off period.
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It's winter. Please open a new thread to update us about prices falling in a few months from now.
Build additional nuclear power plants.
seems like finland not the best place for data center?
There was one being built ... But Russian Rosatom was the supplier for the actual nuclear bit
You mean Europe? We have it real good compared to Germany which is a big part of this whole mess
No, we don't have electricity problems in Europe - neither with instability nor high prices.
Despite the high taxes, the prices in Denmark are fine, and we trade electricity with Norway, Sweden, and Germany depending on where in the country you are located.
This is an isolated problem in some single countries.
wtf?
i remember times, it must have been around 2010 when i was in finland, there was a huge outcry because the price for a kw/h was increased from 2.x cents to 3.x cents. but 190 cents / kw/h is really bad!
maybe really long cable to some Hydro energy, you should resell pirate energy. we can establish a trade route where we carry our batteries
You save from the AC power
1.9€ is so cuck.
Please turn the other cheek, take another jab or two, blame the Russkies, kill another scape goat, and pay your tributes to Our Democracy (they love us!).
Look! the American banks are helping us!
That's my contribution to the discussion.
If you rely on the batteries every day, they're likely going to be dead within that time frame.
Not sure how much sun there is there, but have you considered installing solar panels on the roof?
LiFePo4 packs last like 30 years. It's still unknown how long because LFP is still too new to have 30+ years of data.
Yes capacity decreases, if you do 100% DoD everytime it's like 1000 cycles, but even that at 10 years is like 64% capacity remaining. This is if you do 100% DoD everytime. If you only do 80%; Like you should and leaving say 20minutes as backup power, the longevity increases dramatically. Temperature and rate of charge/discharge affects a lot as well.
Also consider this; Lead Acid now costs more per KWh than LiFePo4, is guaranteed dead by 10 years, and should be replaced at 5 years, even if you never cycle them.
Container sized we can get with financing, includes everything, you just hook it up and it immediately starts not just arbitrage with the grid but actually frequency stabilization, which pays multiples over simple spot pricing arbitrage. They claimed less than 3 years ROI even with their 12% service fee they take.
Solar -> Almost none during winter. Southern Finland gets some, but northern Finland might not see any sun for months. It's pretty much useless during these coldest months.
This is sarcasm right? You do realize Denmark is part of the same Europe as Germany is who destroyed their power infrastructure and now makes everyone else pay for it too?
Our grids are connected, and everyone sells or buys from each other.
2 years back Finland was known to have the lowest prices in Europe. Year averages wear like 40-50€/MWh or 0.04-0.05€/KWh
https://www.dst.dk/en/Statistik/emner/miljoe-og-energi/energiforbrug-og-energipriser/energipriser this says your average price of H1/2023 was 0.38€/KWh. Doesn't sound cheap and unaffected to me. Sounds exactly at around Germany level.
I want to highlight this part.
I totally agree.
Without this mess pulsedmedia would be renting me an intel N100 server for 15 euros a month.
You are looking at the high prices last winter that were high because Russia manipulated the gas and oil prices. You can't use that to compare with normal prices.
Today the average price is lower but we have never had average prices as low 0.04-0.05€/KWh i Denmark. Average prices that low isn't realistic in countries with limited or without nuclear power.
I guess you are a Russian living in Finland since you blame "Europe" for destroying power infrastructure. I'm not interested in wasting my time on Russia vs The West discussions, so I leave this thread here.
i have a VPS in Finland
i hope no price increase.... my VPS is a bargin...
At least you have lakupiippu.
It was H1, meaning 01-06, as stated on the page.
Or did you have -20C weather in June too? :O
I am Finnish, born in Finland. I see you are out of arguments to try an ad hominem attack.
Reality is that Germany closed their Nuclear Plants etc. Every country in EU has been closing all kinds of plants for "green movement", this is no way secret and is in the EU plans.
I did not bring up Russia, you did.
I Repeat,, last i checked Denmark resided in Europe, south of Sweden. Therefore, Denmark is affected by general European energy markets.
There is currently power outages here and there in Finland. Our shop @ Kerava, same building as new DC is going to be in had a power flicker lasting more than 1 second as well.
There's large outage in Tampere.
Record breaking for 2000s cold in north too.
Yesterday some power plants failed, ought to be back online now.
Grid is straining, and all those events and weather leads to these record high prices.
28day average spot price for electricity is "only" 9.83cnt/KWh tho.
Nowhere close what it was at Q4/22-Q1/23
Oh apparently in Kerava was large outage too, must've happened when that flicker was. Already fixed tho, took them 20minutes to repair the high voltage line damage. more than 12 000 households dark.
What would it cost you to run on generator at peak times?
Lol. EU diesel taxes. And the gener...
ahahah can't type anymo
Exactly! Finland and Baltic states seems to be hit right now, where the rest of the Europe enjoys cheap electricity.
@PulsedMedia what you should do is make a long term contract with your energy supplier that locks energy prices for some time. It would probably be a bit more expensive than some past long term average (that's how insurance works), yet you would then have price stability.
And these (hopefully) temporary fluctuations would be of no interest to you. You could then account for that known energy price right into your product, and be sure that calculation would work for you for a long time. Or at least during the duration of the contract.
And this then translates right into price stability to your customers. Everybody sleeps well. 
Win - win, is it?
Uh, we are not fully on spot pricing, and on our DC we can't affect the pricing. They have 40% lock and 60% spot pricing on their larger pool of purchases. Next DC we are building tho we have direct control, and plan is partial lock, partial spot pricing. This is not magic, there's a huge industry around this; You know, it's quite common to have electricity in the building, whaddya know
This 1.9€/KWh is for 1 hour tomorrow, and the month average is more like 0.095€/KWh. I linked this info.
These "temporary price fluctuations" are not magic; Even if you have locked in price this stuff affects the prices you can lock for in long term, because market condition has changed. There is no free lunch least of all in energy/commodity markets.
People confuse spot pricing with long term locked in pricing, or average prices constantly.
If i recall right maths from year ago it was something like 0.6-0.7€/KWh + Cost of genie, installation etc. Bringing the total cost way way high unless you use it a lot to amortize the cost of genie + upkeep + installation over large amount of use.
Well you have to annually use 1 tank regardless, needs to be replaced annually even if you don't use it. Also annually change oil and filters + testing even if you haven't been using it.
Running large generators are not cheap.
I live in Finland and I was just talking with my wife earlier about this. It's so bad that you kinda have to plan when you want to do things that use a lot of electricity..
Cry me a river
@PulsedMedia
Your Batteries and panels will be dead in 5-7 years top, inverters, same.
Please search for other options / colo maybe?
That does not worth the expense.
Does your GOV step in to help businesses? Isn't there a help plan?
That was a really shitty move to close those plants, for all the countries in the EU that joined the "green movement" without having actual working alternatives, and actually, Nuclear Power Plants at the output of MW/hour are the most efficient of all, miles away from coal or hydro, they work even at night
, so they are actually "clean" compared to the rest.
Only the idiotic EU is pushing green shit stuff to the extreme, all others do not give a flying chicken, like 640M ( EU ) will make a difference in a 8B world. Pretty smart these EU folks.
at ±1.7 USD / Liter, not an option in EU.
Near country cost 2 to 6 Rubles /KWh
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Russian_federal_subjects_by_average_wage