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Hetzner - Traffic Use Notice - unlimited != unlimited - Page 6
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Hetzner - Traffic Use Notice - unlimited != unlimited

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Comments

  • @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

  • @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Thanked by 2iKeyZ PulsedMedia
  • I think that Hetzner needs to state clearly that its unlimited dedis are fair use unlimited with 250 TB or less. It needs clear policy as what Terrahost is doing. So that buyers will have realistic expectation.

    Thanked by 2xrz sliix
  • xrzxrz Member
    edited July 2022

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    that is true.

    what is not true that 250 TB != unlimited

    but unlimited is a lie. they need to specify how much TB you can do per month

  • @letlover said:
    I think that Hetzner needs to state clearly that its unlimited dedis are fair use unlimited with 250 TB or less. It needs clear policy as what Terrahost is doing. So that buyers will have realistic expectation.

    Why the random 250? Because that is what was in the OP's post?

    Thanked by 1PulsedMedia
  • ralfralf Member
    edited July 2022

    @xrz said:
    unlimited means unlimited and not 250 TB

    The point everybody is making is that your friend is currently getting unlimited bandwidth, and will continue to get unlimited bandwidth until the end of the contract.

    What Hetzner have told your friend is that you are placing far more demands on their system than anyone else and if it continues they won't allow the contract to be renewed. They've left the ball firmly in your friend's court as to what to do about it, but they are quite deliberately not breaking their existing promise to your friend.

  • xrzxrz Member

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: Why the random 250?

    All above is not profitable for hetzner maybe?

  • @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Does not change the fact that it is false advertising. Simple As. They make one claim when you order and another when you use the service.

    Thanked by 2xrz Astro
  • @xrz said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    that is true.

    what is not true that 250 TB != unlimited

    but unlimited is a lie. they need to specify how much TB you can do per month

    You aren't getting it - you have had unlimited use for the term you agreed to. They informed you, you may have future issues- hence you may not have a new term. But that is a decision they are making, but they have not impinged on the performace of the contract you agreed to. They didn't agree anywhere to provide service to you forever at the current level- It just didn't happen. You signed for a month, they said there may be future ussues. Guess what, you didnt sign for more than a month, so you accepted vulnerability to change after a month of what they are offering you.

    Thanked by 2xrz PulsedMedia
  • @ReadingIsFundamental said:
    And you received umlimited and are receiving unlimited during your contractually agreed term. The fact that you didn't sign a longer contract is your issue

    He will post his experience on all related forums. Then all potential users consider Hetzner's unlimited is 250 TB/m and less.

    Thanked by 1xrz
  • @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Does not change the fact that it is false advertising. Simple As. They make one claim when you order and another when you use the service.

    Where did they claim unlimited was forever (on their site and in their terms), not on a random website forum. The advertising was for the term agreed to, which in their terms they can prevent future agreements.

    Thanked by 2iKeyZ PulsedMedia
  • @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Does not change the fact that it is false advertising. Simple As. They make one claim when you order and another when you use the service.

    Where did they claim unlimited was forever (on their site and in their terms), not on a random website forum. The advertising was for the term agreed to, which in their terms they can prevent future agreements.

    They have not changed their advertising to reflect any changes in the offer. It is a case of provider offers a service, the user uses the service as per the contract and the provider wants out because they don't want to comply with what they advertised.

    I'm going to bed (getting tired of your arguments that make no sense).

    Thanked by 1TODO
  • xrzxrz Member
    edited July 2022

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: Where did they claim unlimited was forever

    https://docs.hetzner.com/robot/general/traffic

    "All root servers have a dedicated 1 GBit uplink by default and with it unlimited traffic."

    So if you purchase unlimited you basically purchase now 250 TB, so ? its a lie

    Thanked by 1TODO
  • letloverletlover Member
    edited July 2022

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    that is true.

    what is not true that 250 TB != unlimited

    but unlimited is a lie. they need to specify how much TB you can do per month

    You aren't getting it - you have had unlimited use for the term you agreed to. They informed you, you may have future issues- hence you may not have a new term. But that is a decision they are making, but they have not impinged on the performace of the contract you agreed to. They didn't agree anywhere to provide service to you forever at the current level- It just didn't happen. You signed for a month, they said there may be future ussues. Guess what, you didnt sign for more than a month, so you accepted vulnerability to change after a month of what they are offering you.

    You are wrong actually. If Hetzner terminates the contract the month after because the user is using 250 TB this month, it is breaking the term of unlimited already. Do you get my point? Hetzner may use other excuses to terminate him, but anyways, he will vent out on the whole internet, and Hetzner loses.

    Thanked by 2afn TODO
  • xrzxrz Member
    edited July 2022

    @letlover
    it was just a warning to cool down on unlimited traffic, we did, and packing our bags.

  • @letlover said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    that is true.

    what is not true that 250 TB != unlimited

    but unlimited is a lie. they need to specify how much TB you can do per month

    You aren't getting it - you have had unlimited use for the term you agreed to. They informed you, you may have future issues- hence you may not have a new term. But that is a decision they are making, but they have not impinged on the performace of the contract you agreed to. They didn't agree anywhere to provide service to you forever at the current level- It just didn't happen. You signed for a month, they said there may be future ussues. Guess what, you didnt sign for more than a month, so you accepted vulnerability to change after a month of what they are offering you.

    You are wrong actually. If Hetzner terminates the contract because the user is using 250 TB this month, it is breaking the term of unlimited already. Do you get my point? Hetzner may use other excuses to terminate him, but anyways, he will vent out on the whole internet, and Hetzner loses.

    All they have to say is the usage affects other customers and their network. Game over.

    Thanked by 2xrz PulsedMedia
  • @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Does not change the fact that it is false advertising. Simple As. They make one claim when you order and another when you use the service.

    Where did they claim unlimited was forever (on their site and in their terms), not on a random website forum. The advertising was for the term agreed to, which in their terms they can prevent future agreements.

    Nobody reads the small prints from the beginning to the end, unless there is an issue. So marketing realistically is a prudent approach to not get back fired.

  • xrzxrz Member
    edited July 2022

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: All they have to say is the usage affects other customers and their network. Game over.

    No needed to say, we cool down the traffic already and moving away, wish after this hetzner state real traffic usage allowance per month

    Thanked by 2letlover TODO
  • ralfralf Member

    @xrz said:
    No needed to say, we cool down the traffic already and moving away, wish after this hetzner state real traffic usage allowance per month

    Why does it matter to you now if you're leaving anyway?

    Thanked by 2xrz vimalware
  • xrzxrz Member
    edited July 2022

    @ralf said: Why does it matter to you now if you're leaving anyway?

    So you can see that hetzner unlimited != unlimited and they lied
    We was falsely advertised unlimited when purchased servers and got to this situation

    Thanked by 1TODO
  • @xrz said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: All they have to say is the usage affects other customers and their network. Game over.

    No needed to say, we cool down the traffic already and moving away, wish after this hetzner state real traffic usage allowance per month

    Hetzner's network capacity should be based on the assumption that all users are using 320 TB/m. This is not your fault actually. This is simply not enough redundancy and overhead room in capacity in network and other areas.

  • afnafn Member

    @letlover said: Although in some sense, we as Hetnzer's low traffic users make up our rents for him.

    I don't need other clients to "make up" for my server rental. I have other servers doing low traffic to make up for it myself. If you average out between my servers, in theory, it should be less than a 100 TB per server (too lazy to do exact math right now, it's late 🥱 )

  • sunnygsunnyg Member

    I'm actually glad Hetzner is taking this stand. If you're going to blast 250TB traffic per month on $30/month servers, 100% you need the boot, no offense to the OP.

    I've had to cancel servers in the $100-200 range because the network has become dogshit over the last few months.

    This is basically what the network is now https://i.imgur.com/h3RdgXI.png
    Last year, every server in FSN used to flatline to 945Mb/s during an iperf test to AMS.

    High five to your team from me @Hetzner_OL

  • @xrz said:
    So you can see that hetzner unlimited != unlimited and they lied
    We was falsely advertised unlimited when purchased servers and now this

    Ok... so practically the whole forum knows this... now will you stop?

  • @letlover said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Does not change the fact that it is false advertising. Simple As. They make one claim when you order and another when you use the service.

    Where did they claim unlimited was forever (on their site and in their terms), not on a random website forum. The advertising was for the term agreed to, which in their terms they can prevent future agreements.

    Nobody reads the small prints from the beginning to the end, unless there is an issue. So marketing realistically is a prudent approach to not get back fired.

    If you don't read an agreement- that is on you and quite frankly isn't a good idea.

    And a one month contract really is a one month contract, whether you like that fact or not.

    Thanked by 1PulsedMedia
  • edited July 2022

    @letlover said:

    @xrz said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said: All they have to say is the usage affects other customers and their network. Game over.

    No needed to say, we cool down the traffic already and moving away, wish after this hetzner state real traffic usage allowance per month

    Hetzner's network capacity should be based on the assumption that all users are using 320 TB/m. This is not your fault actually. This is simply not enough redundancy and overhead room in capacity in network and other areas.

    That is asinine. To start with- what time of day, what region, what exchange, what cost, what redundacy. To just say 320 is STUPID

  • comXyzcomXyz Member

    How can I hide the comments from some annoying fundamental members? I though it was a featured requested before.

  • letloverletlover Member
    edited July 2022

    @afn said:

    @letlover said: Although in some sense, we as Hetnzer's low traffic users make up our rents for him.

    I don't need other clients to "make up" for my server rental. I have other servers doing low traffic to make up for it myself. If you average out between my servers, in theory, it should be less than a 100 TB per server (too lazy to do exact math right now, it's late 🥱 )

    My dedis use very little bw, maybe a few TBs per month. Actually I should help Hetzner to oust this bad customer. LOL.
    But on the other hand, I, as an end user, should protect an end user's right. In this case, he is right, unlimited should be unlimited, otherwise, state clearly, fair use unlimited.

  • netomxnetomx Moderator, Veteran

    tl;dr

    Just accept, or go with another provider.

    250TB is TOO MUCH, dont say like it isnt

    Thanked by 3iKeyZ kdh PulsedMedia
  • @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @letlover said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @MatthewM said:

    @ReadingIsFundamental said:

    @xrz said:

    please can you stop your legal talking?

    this is about false advertising of unlimited

    Claiming false advertising is a legal claim that you are making

    How is it not false advertising?

    Hetzner claims to provide Unlimited and Guaranteed bandwidth at 1Gbit/s on their product. They are claiming the usage is too high by using the TOS for ending the contract for any reason. Sounds like a open-and-shut case of false advertising to me.

    Except it was a one month contract and they have not limited it during the current contract term, nor have they specified a termination date that is within the current contractual period. Hence they broke no laws and provided all services as ordered.

    Does not change the fact that it is false advertising. Simple As. They make one claim when you order and another when you use the service.

    Where did they claim unlimited was forever (on their site and in their terms), not on a random website forum. The advertising was for the term agreed to, which in their terms they can prevent future agreements.

    Nobody reads the small prints from the beginning to the end, unless there is an issue. So marketing realistically is a prudent approach to not get back fired.

    If you don't read an agreement- that is on you and quite frankly isn't a good idea.

    And a one month contract really is a one month contract, whether you like that fact or not.

    You cheat me once, that is your fault. You cheat me twice, that is my fault.
    Have you heard of this proverb? :)

    Thanked by 1afn
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