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Incero & SpeedyKVM throws the ban hammer at ALL LET members.
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I've watched your business grow through your words and comments on this sub. You've been pretty open in that regard. It's pretty easy to see the progression from a simple project to a full fledged business and the growth of this community in support of your business. Discussions in regards to email hosting tend to result in a recommendation at least once of mxroute. There is no doubt in my mind that this community has given you great success in your business that you wouldn't have found otherwise as a start up with minimal marketing budget.
Last I checked I haven't seen mxroute advertised in too many other mediums. In fact if you google "mxroute" the majority of links will have some reference to lowendtalk. For example:
So don't come here telling me this community didn't build your business. We both know it did.
What you are saying though is that you have zero plans to leave incero or even put pressure on them to revise their ToS. That's not loyalty.
You were an admin of this board. Just because you left a few weeks ago doesn't scratch that fact. You had a direct hand in building this community, and this community had a direct hand in supporting your business venture. The same community you helped build is now being singled out by your own provider as being untrustworthy and unworthy of service. That should bother you.
If ALL of your direct customers are on the Dallas Incero servers than there is a problem. If you've decided the best idea is to put every one of your servers under one house then you have a problem. But you fortunately didn't. Not all of your customers or their resold customers are under Incero's house. I imagine the number is much smaller than that.
Duplicating a server to a new host, changing the TTL of the DNS for those servers to 5 mins, then switching over is frustrating. But inbound MX should respond quickly to that. Yea it's annoying and difficult but it's not something that should cause massive downtime.
Lets be honest, the fact that your scared to speak your mind without incero's a-hole admins striking you down speaks wonders. If your business is under a house of matches that can come crashing down because your provider's admin is hormonal and unprofessional than you should seriously reconsider hosting there.
This isn't a playground argument. Your client's data is hosted in a DC where the admin/owner is a complete unprofessional idiot. You think that's comforting to us here?
I'll get right on migrating that 6TB of data and causing downtime for tens of thousands of users (especially since i have to bring down 2 servers for roughly a week to do it, can't undo software RAID1 and high usage later, they're just facts of life) to please you in reaction to a playground fight on LET.
You can't reason with some people. Everyone's an expert.
Happy to refund you whatever you want @sureiam, but I'll not be interested in you telling me what it's like to run my business anymore. You don't know anything about what I do, why I do it, or what my hurdles are. You just think you know everything. Maybe approach me privately and ask me to learn instead of being an asshole in public. There's no excuse for what you're doing, and I'm not explaining to you every single aspect of my infrastructure and 4 years of reasoning behind decisions just to please you in this little thread. Grow up and talk to me in private if you're actually interested in knowing something, rather than lecturing me in public about what you don't.
Absolutely pathetic and bad form. I have no beef with you, you just wanted one so you decided to make one.
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adding it to the signature might result in changing the signature rule
I currently operate in 7 locations, mentioning all in my signature would be "fun".
Are you really interested in discussing my infrastructure or just creating drama? Because if you are, I'm happy to explain it all to you in private. This is stupid, you're lecturing me on things you have no knowledge of. You've spent zero hours managing my business and infrastructure. You're literally creating drama just to create it.
And yes I am telling you I don't have failover. If I did, I'd advertise it. I created a budget service and marketed it as such. Don't be a dick. It's exactly in line with LET host standards to not have failover.
Fair enough. It's incredibly rude of me to discuss such things here publicly, I apologize. However I'm heated that you don't seem to have any plans to drop Incero. No one's asking you to do this overnight, but leaving Incero after this insult would be the right thing to do. No matter how long it takes to do it.
Those are excerpts and the context is important too. Ex.
Your "disapproval" about this brand's conduct is way less than the disapproval you display about the current administration. So much that the first sentence sounds merely rhetorical.
Same applies here.
On other replies you seemed condemning more some actions taken while AntonySmith was asleep; down the road the position slightly changed. Besides any knee-jerk reaction initially taken, AnthonySmith made a really nice proposal imho.
Then we have this. This community, the same community you administered till a couple of days ago, feels insulted, yet you don't see how this relate. In the past you made efforts to hear from the community, maybe even too much. Now you don't see how things relate, uptime is an higher value.
You're not required to start trash talking about your current provider, nor to spit in the face of your customer and their business. Nor to be anything less than an adult. Let's not play extremes. Some of your posts were spot-on. I don't expect you to move elsewhere nor to change your business plan, pitchforks may be pleased with a different attitude too.
The provider didn't take anything from me. At the time, from my understanding, LET administration had. Are you not understanding that? Is there a better way I can explain it?
I was speaking logically based on the facts that I had at hand, I'm confused as to how that upsets you. Do you prefer that I speak emotionally? I can't win on that front. Some people give me shit for being emotional, others give me shit for being factual. Give a guy a break.
Incorrect. I just put my customers before the satisfaction of the small number of people participating in this thread.
Hearing from the community does not mean wiping out my customer base to achieve satisfaction rating in a single LET thread.
@quick not the place for this.
Could also be in the providers profile. Possibly with a sig hint like "more info in profile".
My point is about not terrorizing or punishing providers and yet at the same time allowing users to make educated decisions. That way you wouldn't be punished or put at a disadvantage but users who want to avoid incero have a fair chance to know whether a given provider is with incero.
gordons amok action should get a tough answer but not one that does punish all providers being with incero.
P.S. Also works the other way around: Seeing, for instance, @Clouvider as upstream is a major plus in my eyes.
Too soon man...
You bunch of fucking cunts.
Thank you. A good morning to you, too.
I agree. We should definitely know if an offer is being hosted by a provider that doesn't want this community and that is run apparently by an idiot. The second part being the key area of concern.
Sadly you can't guess my emotive state from a post, but I'm perfectly calm and cool. I'm not attacking you. I believe that communication is important, especially if you're a provider (like yourself) and you attach your name and face to your business. So I just pointed out something I deemed important (context, how some of your posts are perceived). Your reply sounds pretty emotional (really, no offence here) and you're still playing extremes here and there. I'm sorry if some passages sounded to you like an aggression or something. I get that maybe you read my post in the midst of a discussion where you're put between a stone and a hard place and caught you "sensible" on some points. Especially since we're all waiting for AnthonySmith's closing statement.
@Jarland if you're not planning any new LET offers til Black Friday it sounds like you're not affected by this potential LET rule change til at least then. Meanwhile I agree with bsdguy that Incero looks like a meltdown waiting to happen. I wouldn't want them as a SPOF in anything important that I was doing. If I had stuff with them I might not be trying to pull out right away, and I understand not wanting to implement cross-provider hot failover on a budget service. But I'd certainly be figuring out a Plan B if I didn't have one already.
Pretty much 24 hours, no comment from Incero directly or indirectly.
So lets call this an open letter and a closing statement.
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Gordon.
What this confirms in my mind, is that you, Gordon, the owner, responsible decision maker, really do not care, not only do you not care what we thousands of people who happen to be members of a forum think of this decision you clearly have no regard what so ever for the impact your decisions have on your own customers.
I am not talking about individual or a handful of VPS customers, I am talking about customers such as Jarland, Alex, Octay etc that quite literally built successful brands on the back of Incero.
You do not care what impact your actions have now or at any time in the future on these customers who depend on you being a rational businessman in order to make a living and feed their families.
I made the offer to help achieve the goal of dissuading LET members from buying from Incero it was ignored, I offered to literally kill every link for all of your main brands and de-index every offer and drop this thread. This in turn would have had a much higher success rate at achieving the apparent goal. It was ignored.
The goal used was a lie, the only thing that update to your terms of service was intended to do was satisfy the rage of you, an unreasonable man child with an impulse control issue even in the face of damaging your customers directly, you would not send an email with or without salutations containing 3 words "OK go ahead", your customers are not even worth that to you.
Gordon, you and your brands are now and for the foreseeable future banned from LET, I will not even engage in any sort of future communication unless a public apology is made first.
Without prejudice.
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For the LET community, I would like to make something else clear, I never at any point had any real intention of banning downstream hosts etc from posting here, I made that clear to the staff and a few trusted people in advance of starting this shit show. I believe the words I used were: "OK looks like I have to play the dick head here for 24 hours"
I am still at a loss as to what sort of spoiled arrogant twisted brat you would need to be to allow something so simple to resolve when you have the chance of getting additional benefits to make a small change for the sake of your customers.
It is not and will never be my goal to harm or directly impact hosts that have found themselves in a situation through no fault of their own banning people that simply use them as an upstream as many people pointed out would be stupid and childish and completely unreasonable, you could even say "Inceronish", that was just a part I was playing to try and get the best outcome and it was not something I enjoyed doing, I tried, it failed.
Incero are for sure banned and anything directly connected to Gordons primary business ventures are banned as well, I would strongly suggest downstream hosts seriously consider this, if you want the best for your customers I simply would not believe you meant it if you said Incero was the best place for them, not with this guy at the helm.
If there is any future indirect fall out from all this when people post offers based in Incero, I would simply suggest you let Gordon know about it, I am not going to be interested.
Cheers.
Ant.
I will re-open this in a few hours and put it in off topic.
Disagree. What did Anthony achieve by these intimidation tactics other than giving chaps at Incero a reason to laugh at bluffing LETers? First they spit on us, now must be laughing out loud after reading that statement.
His intention was good (to get that clause removed from the ToS) but would have been better if he did nothing instead of pulling this stunt and failing at it.
Some people will only be happy when they get to watch the world burn and everything gets destroyed, that is not my style, I tried, i failed (in the best possible outcome), I proved just how much of a maniac he is and frankly anyone who truly believes I should have burned everyone that even uses Incero as a result of this is a complete arse hole.
My goal was to either get a better outcome for everyone involved including Incero or confirm beyond a doubt that the guy is a moron with no regard for his customers, I have no doubt at all that some of his customers will reconsider their position with Incero after seeing just how little he cares about them.
Since I and my offer thread were mentioned in here I will quote what I posted in the offer thread as this is a direct result of the comments and actions of both Incero and LET administration and members.
All new customers will be refunded in full, older customers will be suggested where to move. I will be of assistance in that move.
I will cancel my services with Incero, not because what the LET administration has done in response to the change of terms. Instead, it is done instead of waiting for the plug to be pulled because I would host LET members using service provided by Incero.
Everyone knew that he is a moron and a retard. If that was part of your goal then congratulations. Neither Incero budged a bit nor his clientele showed any signs of reconsideration in their loyalty and trust in their upstream. No one expected you to burn everything but you could have kept the fire lit a little longer. If you were playing a game, you pulled out too soon.
I’m fucking disgusted that people are trying to pressure providers (reputable providers at that) into dropping Incero.
I’ve never really bought into the whole ‘LET is toxic’ thing - until now. Some of you are really, genuinely awful people.
heh. ok.
Wake up and look around. You will see plenty of toxicity from massive trolling and topic derails to plain FUD.
WHT is dead because of greed and shilling. LET will eventually die due to trolls and stagnation.
For those who have just tuned in... new TL;DR: Gordon is still a cunt.
I don’t agree.
Careful though, I am pretty sure that is how most will have interpreted your initial intention based on your comments. You can back track on the basis of "I never really meant it", but it just make you look weak and well, kinda more the arse hole than anyone who was supposed to know you weren't being serious about it.
+1
Appreciate the concern. I can assure you that there is nothing in this thread that causes my customers increased risk.