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[MXroute] Buy this before I sober up

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  • szarkaszarka Member

    @jar said:

    @szarka said: Just curious what the limiting factor is? Cash flow to turn up more servers, administrator time, something else?

    I've been on the fence for a while now on what and where I want to deploy for the next reseller box. I really like Hetzner for it but I also don't really want to grow further there. When cancellations are processed I usually end up with a few of each reseller package in stock, and they stay in stock for a few weeks. So while there are extended periods without stock, and they do sell, it's not quite at the level of people beating down the door to get to them. So I've got some more time to decide where I'll take it next. Honestly, kinda thinking about a custom built colocated server for the next one.

    I stopped running a data center and owning my own hardware in 2002, and I only regret it about once per year. ;) Not enough pain to make it worth going back, though I've been tempted to slap an old mid-tower at Joe's just to store backups.

    Of course, my ex-wife and my former employees would tell you that's for the best, since I am not to be trusted with tools.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @szarka said: Of course, my ex-wife and my former employees would tell you that's for the best, since I am not to be trusted with tools.

    I feel you haha

    Thanked by 1szarka
  • @Arkas said:
    @jar What's the easiest way to have a domain/site hosted on a VPS and the domains email's going through mxroute?

    They're really two independent things.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • ArkasArkas Moderator

    @TimboJones said: They're really two independent things.

    Are they really? I mean let's say you have a VPS running a forum, but your IP is shit and you'd like to use your MXRoute account? I know it's hypothetical for most, but I do have a couple of cases were that would really solve my problems fast. For now I'm using a combo of my own mail server and forwardemail.net, but it's not ideal.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • TimboJonesTimboJones Member
    edited June 2022

    @Arkas said:

    @TimboJones said: They're really two independent things.

    Are they really? I mean let's say you have a VPS running a forum, but your IP is shit and you'd like to use your MXRoute account? I know it's hypothetical for most, but I do have a couple of cases were that would really solve my problems fast. For now I'm using a combo of my own mail server and forwardemail.net, but it's not ideal.

    Your mail client will use MXRoute settings to login and send through their infrastructure with just an MX record (needed for receiving email, not sure if needed if sending only). The mail client can be on a VPS or a gameboy or whatever telnet.

    You'd have more work to send emails from the VPS itself, but you're not.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • ArkasArkas Moderator

    @TimboJones said: Your mail client will use MXRoute settings to login and send through their infrastructure with just an MX record.

    Yes, that what @jar told me, it's the easiest method.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • adlyadly Veteran

    @Arkas said:

    @TimboJones said: Your mail client will use MXRoute settings to login and send through their infrastructure with just an MX record.

    Yes, that what @jar told me, it's the easiest method.

    It’s not about being the easiest method, as @TimboJones said, they’re two entirely separate things.

    There is no inherent link between what is hosted via HTTP and the mail server(s). In fact, outside of small sites/single server web hosting, mail is almost always handled by a different server/provider.

    Thanked by 2Arkas jar
  • ArkasArkas Moderator

    @adly said: There is no inherent link between what is hosted via HTTP and the mail server(s). In fact, outside of small sites/single server web hosting, mail is almost always handled by a different server/provider.

    Yes, I know that, I was asking specifically about MXRoute. On my various VPSs and Dedis I use my own mail servers (hosted locally) with a secondary failover IP for each case. With MXRoute, it makes it less complicated for me while making sure my emails get to their destination.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • M66BM66B Veteran

    @Daniel15 said:

    @Hotmarer said:

    @Razza said:
    @Hotmarer what you thinking of is IMAP idle it worked when I used mxroute in the past the mail client pulled new email within 20 or so secs after arrival.

    But you had an email client configured to chcek for email every minute, for example. And I don't want to configure my client this way (sometimes you can't force it, e.g. in apple mail). I would like the mail server to send an email to my phone when it arrives because in one hour I can get 100 emails and nothing in the rest of the day.

    Any good email client will support IMAP IDLE, which will give you instant notifications. It's like a decentralised push service, where the email client connects directly to the mail server for notifications, rather than an intermediary like Google or Apple's notifications server. This also means your email notification content isn't relayed through Google or Apple like it would be when using their push services.

    One downside of IMAP IDLE is that it's per folder. If you have many folders with filtering rules that sort emails into folders, it'll need multiple connections to get push notifications for them. I have a lot of folders and configured my email client (@M66B's FairEmail on Android, and Thunderbird on desktop) to only use push for the most important ones, while the less important ones just check every 15 minutes.

    ActiveSync is very similar to IMAP IDLE, except it uses a long-running HTTP connection rather than a long-running IMAP connection.

    IMAP NOTIFY will avoid a connection per folder. Please see here for some more details:

    https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq162

    There is a good chance mxroute supports this. I have many test email accounts, but no mxroute account, so I can check this myself.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    14 of the summer packages left. Uncertain if I'll spin up a second box for them, it's a hard maybe.

  • Daniel15Daniel15 Veteran
    edited June 2022

    @M66B said:

    @Daniel15 said:

    @Hotmarer said:

    @Razza said:
    @Hotmarer what you thinking of is IMAP idle it worked when I used mxroute in the past the mail client pulled new email within 20 or so secs after arrival.

    But you had an email client configured to chcek for email every minute, for example. And I don't want to configure my client this way (sometimes you can't force it, e.g. in apple mail). I would like the mail server to send an email to my phone when it arrives because in one hour I can get 100 emails and nothing in the rest of the day.

    Any good email client will support IMAP IDLE, which will give you instant notifications. It's like a decentralised push service, where the email client connects directly to the mail server for notifications, rather than an intermediary like Google or Apple's notifications server. This also means your email notification content isn't relayed through Google or Apple like it would be when using their push services.

    One downside of IMAP IDLE is that it's per folder. If you have many folders with filtering rules that sort emails into folders, it'll need multiple connections to get push notifications for them. I have a lot of folders and configured my email client (@M66B's FairEmail on Android, and Thunderbird on desktop) to only use push for the most important ones, while the less important ones just check every 15 minutes.

    ActiveSync is very similar to IMAP IDLE, except it uses a long-running HTTP connection rather than a long-running IMAP connection.

    IMAP NOTIFY will avoid a connection per folder. Please see here for some more details:

    https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq162

    There is a good chance mxroute supports this. I have many test email accounts, but no mxroute account, so I can check this myself.

    @M66B What should I look for in the FairEmail logs to verify that IMAP NOTIFY is in use? The FAQ just says "You can check the log via the navigation menu if an email server supports the NOTIFY capability" but doesn't say what to look for in the logs.

  • @Daniel15 said:

    @M66B said:

    @Daniel15 said:

    @Hotmarer said:

    @Razza said:
    @Hotmarer what you thinking of is IMAP idle it worked when I used mxroute in the past the mail client pulled new email within 20 or so secs after arrival.

    But you had an email client configured to chcek for email every minute, for example. And I don't want to configure my client this way (sometimes you can't force it, e.g. in apple mail). I would like the mail server to send an email to my phone when it arrives because in one hour I can get 100 emails and nothing in the rest of the day.

    Any good email client will support IMAP IDLE, which will give you instant notifications. It's like a decentralised push service, where the email client connects directly to the mail server for notifications, rather than an intermediary like Google or Apple's notifications server. This also means your email notification content isn't relayed through Google or Apple like it would be when using their push services.

    One downside of IMAP IDLE is that it's per folder. If you have many folders with filtering rules that sort emails into folders, it'll need multiple connections to get push notifications for them. I have a lot of folders and configured my email client (@M66B's FairEmail on Android, and Thunderbird on desktop) to only use push for the most important ones, while the less important ones just check every 15 minutes.

    ActiveSync is very similar to IMAP IDLE, except it uses a long-running HTTP connection rather than a long-running IMAP connection.

    IMAP NOTIFY will avoid a connection per folder. Please see here for some more details:

    https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq162

    There is a good chance mxroute supports this. I have many test email accounts, but no mxroute account, so I can check this myself.

    @M66B What should I look for in the FairEmail logs to verify that IMAP NOTIFY is in use? The FAQ just says "You can check the log via the navigation menu if an email server supports the NOTIFY capability" but doesn't say what to look for in the logs.

    Isn't that shown when you telnet to the mailserver and it shows it's capabilities?

  • M66BM66B Veteran

    @Daniel15 said:

    @M66B said:

    @Daniel15 said:

    @Hotmarer said:

    @Razza said:
    @Hotmarer what you thinking of is IMAP idle it worked when I used mxroute in the past the mail client pulled new email within 20 or so secs after arrival.

    But you had an email client configured to chcek for email every minute, for example. And I don't want to configure my client this way (sometimes you can't force it, e.g. in apple mail). I would like the mail server to send an email to my phone when it arrives because in one hour I can get 100 emails and nothing in the rest of the day.

    Any good email client will support IMAP IDLE, which will give you instant notifications. It's like a decentralised push service, where the email client connects directly to the mail server for notifications, rather than an intermediary like Google or Apple's notifications server. This also means your email notification content isn't relayed through Google or Apple like it would be when using their push services.

    One downside of IMAP IDLE is that it's per folder. If you have many folders with filtering rules that sort emails into folders, it'll need multiple connections to get push notifications for them. I have a lot of folders and configured my email client (@M66B's FairEmail on Android, and Thunderbird on desktop) to only use push for the most important ones, while the less important ones just check every 15 minutes.

    ActiveSync is very similar to IMAP IDLE, except it uses a long-running HTTP connection rather than a long-running IMAP connection.

    IMAP NOTIFY will avoid a connection per folder. Please see here for some more details:

    https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq162

    There is a good chance mxroute supports this. I have many test email accounts, but no mxroute account, so I can check this myself.

    @M66B What should I look for in the FairEmail logs to verify that IMAP NOTIFY is in use? The FAQ just says "You can check the log via the navigation menu if an email server supports the NOTIFY capability" but doesn't say what to look for in the logs.

    You should look for the capability "NOTIFY".

  • M66BM66B Veteran

    @jar can you tell if NOTIFY is supported by the mxroute IMAP server? Dovecot does support this, if enabled.

  • TingTing Member

    Looking for service, good stuff, has lifetime, 2 questions,
    1. Is there a convenient upgrade space after the lifetime version?
    2. Will the normal delivery of "qq.com" be blocked?

    Thanks!

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited June 2022

    @Ting said:
    Looking for service, good stuff, has lifetime, 2 questions,
    1. Is there a convenient upgrade space after the lifetime version?
    2. Will the normal delivery of "qq.com" be blocked?

    Thanks!

    Lifetime package can be upgraded to Medium or Large package at any time, fully self service in the billing panel.

    It can actually be difficult to get emails to qq.com under certain conditions. After reviewing performance, customer concerns, and auditing logs around the matter I was able to secure consistent delivery to them for all customers by merely placing one rule: if you need to send hundreds of emails per hour to qq.com, I cannot accommodate it. Anything else, have at it. So if you would send hundreds to them in an hour, just rate limit yourself on the sending side and you’ll be good.

    I am uncertain if the conditions that justified this rule are still present, but by enforcing the rule I was able to eliminate 100% of issues and at most open a ticket with two customers a year over the rule, so I consider that a win all around.

    Thanked by 2ralf scooke
  • ralfralf Member
    edited June 2022

    @jar said:
    It can actually be difficult to get emails to qq.com under certain conditions. After reviewing performance, customer concerns, and auditing logs around the matter I was able to secure consistent delivery to them for all customers by merely placing one rule: if you need to send hundreds of emails per hour to qq.com, I cannot accommodate it. Anything else, have at it. So if you would send hundreds to them in an hour, just rate limit yourself on the sending side and you’ll be good.

    I don't actually need to send any e-mails to qq.com, but when I saw that in the OP, I was a little worried, because QQ is basically like China's gmail, only massively higher market share. I'd guess probably every Chinese person between 30 and 60 has a qq.com account. It might not be their primary e-mail any more, but it'd be kind of crazy to null-route that kind of domain.

    EDIT: OTOH, if you see a lot of mail for it, it probably is mostly spam that don't want to send in China for legal reasons.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @ralf said: EDIT: OTOH, if you see a lot of mail for it, it probably is mostly spam that don't want to send in China for legal reasons.

    Yeah I had a few interesting customers, I still have some like them but not as many. Their websites were only login forms, no clear indication of what they were or why they exist. They would send hundreds of emails to qq.com addresses every hour which to me looked cryptic, so as to say that when reviewing logs I couldn't even guess as to what they were for. They didn't look like spam, but they did look unusual (as in not of any typical variety). What then happened was a host here reached out because a lot of their customers from China weren't able to receive their invoices and registration emails, because QQ began rejecting them. The reason being that they didn't like us. If I cut down the volume per sender, it all cleared up. But if it started again, so did the rejections.

    I don't fully understand what I was in the middle of and what happened, but the resolution at least seemed clear enough.

  • ascicodeascicode Member
    edited June 2022

    @jar How can i login to configure my email accounts, if i didnt use the MXRoute generated username(nickname+e) before? Password wrong, and nothing helps to get any action to work. My registered mail works to login on the site, but yea, cant do anything.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @ascicode said:
    @jar How can i login to configure my email accounts, if i didnt use the MXRoute generated username(nickname+e) before? Password wrong, and nothing helps to get any action to work. My registered mail works to login on the site, but yea, cant do anything.

    From a high level at least these should help:

    https://mxroutedocs.com/directadmin/login/

    https://mxroutedocs.com/directadmin/resetpass/

    Not much different for cpanel. If the password isn’t working select it carefully instead of double clicking it to highlight.

    Thanked by 1ascicode
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited July 2022

    Four of the 100G promos left. I’m leaning toward not adding more as they slowed down in performance on sales, likely trailing off on interest. But if you were on the fence for any reason, just sharing the data. I’m always finding myself being asked for larger plans to return but they won’t be on normal hardware deployments so these promos are the only current plan for them to exist.

  • LeviLevi Member

    Go home Bob, you are drunk.

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited July 2022

    New feature added in: https://accounts.mxroute.com/index.php?/news/view/33/beta--handshake-domain-support/

    Calling it beta because while I've been testing it and load testing it for a while, any feature added into production is a risk. Always has been, always will be. Nothing is guaranteed to be a final, production worthy feature until it survives in production without causing new problems. No reason to suspect issues, everything looks great, monitoring and testing of it are showing flawless results. But if I say it's cemented in as a permanent feature, it'll break in production after being fine in staging this whole time.

    @LTniger said: you are drunk

    Can't drink, have to lose weight, need to be around to take care of you fuckers for a long time.

  • szarkaszarka Member
    edited July 2022

    you might think "Oh, so we would email jarland@mxroute."

    Well, why not do that, tho? No reason you can't have a MX record at the apex of a TLD:

    # host -t mx ai.
    ai mail is handled by 10 mail.offshore.ai.
    
    Thanked by 1jar
  • pikepike Veteran

    @jar said:
    Can't drink, have to lose weight, need to be around to take care of you fuckers for a long time.

    There is GHB tho.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @szarka said:

    you might think "Oh, so we would email jarland@mxroute."

    Well, why not do that, tho? No reason you can't have a MX record at the apex of a TLD:

    # host -t mx ai.
    ai mail is handled by 10 mail.offshore.ai.
    

    Well because I can’t modify DirectAdmin to take a TLD 😉

    Thanked by 2skorous szarka
  • Hey @jar , very cool on the handshake domains! Looking forward to playing with that. Unrelated question, any chance the plus addressing makes a return?

    Thanked by 1jar
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    @skorous said:
    Hey @jar , very cool on the handshake domains! Looking forward to playing with that. Unrelated question, any chance the plus addressing makes a return?

    Should be working everywhere. Give me a holler if it's failing for you.

    Thanked by 2skorous szarka
  • @jar said:

    @skorous said:
    Hey @jar , very cool on the handshake domains! Looking forward to playing with that. Unrelated question, any chance the plus addressing makes a return?

    Should be working everywhere. Give me a holler if it's failing for you.

    Oh nice! Sorry, last I heard it wasn't and hadn't checked in a while.

  • TingTing Member

    Already purchased Lifetime, waiting for host credentials...

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