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Incero & SpeedyKVM throws the ban hammer at ALL LET members.
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The Guardian -14 REASONS WHY Popular hosting provider Incero Networks was BANNED from ONLINE community LowEndTalk
Providers can and should give their feedback, but they should have their existing customers in mind first. It's not a time to burn bridges. I've plenty of feedback to share, it'll be shared in private.
All things considered though there's some really important details to notice: no one in this thread has yet claimed victim of anything related to this. No one today has come forward and said "I was terminated for this policy." No providers have said "My provider wants me to stop offering services here or they're going to drop me."
The words are what they are, I won't downplay them, but the only party here that has taken action to harm someone in relation to this is the LET staff. They've stated that providers using incero will not be allowed to post offers (someone correct me if you feel in misreading that).
The only actual and quantifiable damage from this, beyond hurting someone's feelings, is outgoing from LET. That's a powerful thing to note. Perhaps it even creates a justification that wasn't there before, that the community is toxic enough to outwardly try to harm others in reaction to having their feelings hurt.
Feelings matter, don't get me wrong, but let's not assign them more power than they deserve.
I don't read the Guardian. Too biased. Prefer BBC.
So does @Nekki.
Jarmageddon is nigh.
Dick move from incero. I started to dislike them when they double my vps price for my 1g speedykvm seattle plan.
There is no need to ban offers from resellers, just incero and direct brands. Maybe best thing is to make Announcement and say that whoever buys offer involving incero location can have their service cancelled at any time.
No chance that you and Ryan could massage Gordon a bit?
I mean, you, more than anyone else on LET, probably have the clout to affect Gordon. Or is he that untameable?
That's more what I mean by providers should share feedback but not burn bridges, customers come first. I have my thoughts and private conversations, but that's where they'll end, privately. Ultimately my first responsibility is to my customers.
I miss a certain perspective here. Let me explain: The reason I would warmly welcome if @AnthonySmith prohibited also customers of incero/speedy whatever (Pardon me, I don't know the whole story and am not interested) to publish offers here, although with some kind of warning period.
Reason: LET end user protection.
If incero is such a shithole I don't want to end up there as an end customer. Simple. After all we are a community and a community shouldn't needlessly expose its members to games like those played by speedy/incero.
Being at that I would find it very attractive anyway if providers here at LET needed to clearly tell about their DC and middlemen between them and DC. But that's probably asking too much considering that LET seems to be more of a providers hangout than one for end users/customers.
I'd love to be able to fire back with a witty comeback, but you've got me bang to rights.
Should we care? If he wants to be a dick, that's on him. If he decides to dial it back later, then fine. It's not our job to talk him down, feed his attention whoring, or whatever. Kthxbai seems like a sufficient response to him from here.
Donald J Trump @realDonaldTrump 8 Feb 2018: third tier BBC rated BELOW CNN. VERY FUNNY!!
Hey look, a drama thread, haven't had a good one of these in a while.
I'm throwing my money at the screen but nothing is happening.
That's because you haven't got your cock out yet.
Okay I've done that too. Still nothing, maybe I'm doing it wrong though.
PM'd.
Now take your forefinger, and slowly, slide it into your mouth, and back out again.
Do it once more, look at the screen, and smile at me.
Wouldn't that make sense? They are banning new accounts. You can be happy all day long for your special treatment, but if I go to sign up for an Incero service right now I would be breaching their TOS. I'm smart enough not to, but that doesn't mean I'm not victim to their new hateful TOS.
So got banned for signing up?
TOS is not feeling, Jarland. It's TOS and you can't down play it with rhetoric and make LET staff a bad guy in this situation. TOS has enough power, especially since it's a crappy, legally absurd TOS, which as usual, enforced unilaterally.
I'm talking about existing customers. Who here has been terminated? What existing providers are victim of any action other than that of the LET staff today?
None.
Was just trying to consider a diplomatic solution.
I understand the initial emotional reactions, I really do, but I'd prefer not to penalize as a result all providers that are customers of Incero. Not only would this be an overreaction, but it would also mean a lot of extra police work on the part of the admins & mods, and in my view, it wouldn't be worth the effort.
No, the people they aren't targeting with their new TOS rules aren't being hurt, good observation.
That doesn't make any sense. I specifically said I'm not downplaying it. I'm pointing out a clear fact: The only victim of this today, the only one who has been quantifiably hurt by this, is the provider who runs on Incero's network. They are hurt at the hands of LET staff. You can't downplay that, you can't "rhetoric" your way out of it.
I get it, you want to downplay the effects of this so far, what's the big issue? You can't hang a threat over an entire community and then justify it with "who have been affected so far?". But anyway that's a deflection away from the main issues.
If you were still admin you would shrug and tell everyone to man up, get it over it and so on. No offence but I am glad you are not admin for this at least, there is no way you would fight for the principle because you are too personally connected to Incero. That has been evident during your tenure whenever they come up in threads. I understand that conflict though.
For all its faults the forum has a lot of good members, content, offers and so on. If the staff won't take a stand against being publically labelled in the same category as HF by a provider then the risk is that it ends up like a promotion to the wrong people and we attract more shit from the likes of HF who think LET is on a par with them.
Even for those members who don't care either way that does not mean LET should sit back and just take it if the measures it can apply are not very punitive it is still a message.
One provider today putting LET in their ToS, another tomorrow does the same, the damage mounts up.
Glad you understand what's happening here. LET staff are outwardly attacking providers, no one else has been actively harmed.
I'm not downplaying a goddamn thing. Show me one person here actively hurt other than the provider who is hurt by the LET staff. It's a fact that no one else has been directly and quantifiably hurt, and that the only ones who are facing such direct and quantifiable hurt are providers at the hands of LET staff. If those facts bother you or make you want to try to subtract from what I'm saying, that is a bit more interesting. You can't subtract from it though, I'm merely pointing out raw and unedited fact.
Incero fucked up. LET staff fucked up worse. Plain and simple. @AnthonySmith doesn't want providers here anymore, he's going to hold them accountable to how the community feels about their vendors. He made a huge mistake, and unless I've missed something he's sticking by it.
Honest question, is it the fact that they put LET beside hack forms that is causing the outrage or just the fact that they don’t want you?
Many providers ban customers from specific countries due to extreme abuse from the customers that signup from there. It might not be every person from that country causing the problems but enough that it causes the provider harm. From the ticket reply from Incero it sounds like that is the case and they are attempting to protect themselves from the signup abuse.
Now I’m not saying it’s a perfect solution but I really do think a bigger deal is being made out of this than it needs to be.
~snip~
Yeah, I think things will out just fine after a settling in period. He is on the right track.