C1Vhosting is scam

Pwner

@caniac22 said:

@Pwner said:

You shouldn't have to read the ToS to know that a company needs 90 days to deliver an order. The company that hides this within their ToS is knowingly doing so as a shady attempt to rip off the average customer.

So you agree with me? Because that's exactly what I said in the second paragraph!

I disagree with the first part expecting the OP to read the ToS, if the product shows availability and it's a standard order, it's not fair to be expected to read every ToS from every company to have to check for hidden scams around the service delivery. Do you read the ToS for every website you browse and software you install on your computer? If so, you're an anomaly.

deadpool

@Pwner said:

I disagree with the first part expecting the OP to read the ToS, if the product shows availability and it's a standard order, it's not fair to be expected to read every ToS from every company to have to check for hidden scams around the service delivery. Do you read the ToS for every website you browse and software you install on your computer? If so, you're an anomaly.

I don't always read the ToS but if there's a problem I always reference it before I post my dirty laundry. If it was my fault I try to be more reasonable with the seller and try to come up with a resolution.

Ultimately if this went to court (I know it's not) the ToS he accepted before signup would support the seller.

LowHosting

@gbzret4d said:

@LowHosting said:

@TimboJones said:

@TWC said:
I am fairly certain that this happened due to the language barrier issue between the two parties.

"AndrewSSD" is clearly an alias (not sure why... very unprofessional, and slightly dishonest) and he doesn't really understand that the law is on C1V's side, and that you can't be a brute if you want to resolve the situation in your favor, especially if you've already paid for something.

You can either be polite, and understanding of the law (and the law is on C1V's side even though it sucks) or you can attempt to have their payments account suspended and risk getting absolutely nothing, especially if you really are using a false identity.

In any case; I'd count my blessings and lay low, since you're really not doing yourself any favors by going public with this...

I was initially on the seller's side if it was clearly communicated delivery was up to 90 days.

But the buyer asked for the subnet IP's and it was provided. That is a reasonable assumption that it's immediately available. Otherwise, the response should have been he doesn't know, yet, as order hasn't yet been fulfilled.

Tl;dr buyer was under false pretense that he'd get immediate delivery and then told it will be 90 days. (Note, no care to imply it would happen any sooner)

So yes, I would consider this seller shady AF.

I agree with you.

I missed that he had given him the IP of the subnet, I did a little check now and it appears that 88.151.9.0/24 (the subnet provided) is owned by ORG-SS1215-RIPE (Splynx s.r.o.) and not by C1VHosting, it seems like they are reselling it.
https://apps.db.ripe.net/db-web-ui/query?searchtext=88.151.9.0/24

Splynx sells a billing & network management system for isps, i dont think they are reselling ip subnets or atleast no info about it on their website.

Anyway ill come back in 89 days to take a look at C1V's answer.

You didn't understand me, maybe.

I said that the subnet provided by C1VHosting on the screenshot sent by @AndrewSSD is owned by "Splynx s.r.o." and not by C1VHosting, considering that, it means C1VHosting is leasing it from "Splynx s.r.o.", check the RIPE:
https://apps.db.ripe.net/db-web-ui/query?searchtext=88.151.9.0/24

This can be also the reason for the long delivery time, he had to buy it in turn from another provider.

SillyGoose

Another Reselling chase. Guess I'll buy from cogent and resell those ip "new bizzness idea"

Mumbly

@gbzret4d said: Splynx sells a billing & network management system for isps, i dont think they are reselling ip subnets or atleast no info about it on their website.

Where are your lowenddetective skills?

Splynx = isp-servis.ru = isp-servis.cz

Take a look at:
http://isp-servis.cz/?page_id=312
https://www.ripe.net/membership/indices/data/cz.vissado.html

DP

Void

🤨

M66B

@AndrewSSD take a look here:

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treatment/unfair-contract-terms/index_en.htm

I guess point 9 applies (I am not a lawyer):

"Terms which bind consumers even though they could not easily have been aware of them before signing the contract"

Which means:

"Contract terms that are unfair under EU law have no legal or binding force on consumers"

newfulluser

Wait 90 days? So paypal buyer protection expires and you can't request a refund?

Francisco

@newfulluser said:
Wait 90 days? So paypal buyer protection expires and you can't request a refund?

Should be 180 days.

Francisco

DP

@newfulluser said: 90

Not sure if it's 90 days, 90 weeks, 90 months or 90 years.

But one thing's for sure, Andrew So Seriously Disappointed.

Levi

The most important that aleged scammer is still on the loose. No warnings, no ban. NO DRAMA.

duckeeyuck

@c1vhosting so your response is basically "our ToS allows us 90 days" and that's it?
is this what everyone should expect from you?

DP

But seriously, any updates?

@AndrewSSD, did you get your IPs or did you get a refund?

c1vhosting

@DP said:
But seriously, any updates?

@AndrewSSD, did you get your IPs or did you get a refund?

He has already received his subnet yesterday!

DP

@c1vhosting said:

@DP said:
But seriously, any updates?

@AndrewSSD, did you get your IPs or did you get a refund?

He has already received his subnet yesterday!

@AndrewSSD - Andrew Subnet Successfully Delivered?

AndrewSSD

@DP said:

@c1vhosting said:

@DP said:
But seriously, any updates?

@AndrewSSD, did you get your IPs or did you get a refund?

He has already received his subnet yesterday!

@AndrewSSD - Andrew Subnet Successfully Delivered?

I just got it today, I don't have a word to tell this is the longest period i waited ever to receive a purchase since 2004 until today.

Thanks to all members for pushing @c1vhosting sending the subnet, This is an LET army , also please @c1vhosting be clear with everyone and adjust the statement of 90 this is your right to say what you want but you need to tell everyone that your services takes upto 90 days to be delivered, Also don't ignore your client requests if someone wants a refund just refund him, There is no reason to keep us waiting for a service all this period.

emg

Nice to see that @AndrewSSD got the subnet they ordered. Having said that, I maintain that @c1vhosting is a business that is following deceptive practices. How many other customers fell for the deception?

Future C1VHosting checkouts should include an accurate, reasonable delivery estimate. Otherwise, clear notice must be provided that delivery may take place up to 90 days after payment is made, with a click-through to confirm customer acceptance of the policy before committing the order.

Well, @c1vhosting? When do you plan to make those very reasonable changes to your informed customer ordering process?

c1vhosting

@emg said:
Nice to see that @AndrewSSD got the subnet they ordered. Having said that, I maintain that @c1vhosting is a business that is following deceptive practices. How many other customers fell for the deception?

Future C1VHosting checkouts should include an accurate, reasonable delivery estimate. Otherwise, clear notice must be provided that delivery may take place up to 90 days after payment is made, with a click-through to confirm customer acceptance of the policy before committing the order.

Well, @c1vhosting? When do you plan to make those very reasonable changes to your informed customer ordering process?

Thanks for your feedback

emg

@c1vhosting said:

Thanks for your feedback

You're welcome, but I would appreciate details about what C1VHosting will change to prevent future misunderstandings.

If nothing changes, then I assert that C1VHosting actively follows deceptive business practices.

Arkas

@c1vhosting should have some sort of consequence for this.

DP

@c1vhosting said:

@emg said:
Nice to see that @AndrewSSD got the subnet they ordered. Having said that, I maintain that @c1vhosting is a business that is following deceptive practices. How many other customers fell for the deception?

Future C1VHosting checkouts should include an accurate, reasonable delivery estimate. Otherwise, clear notice must be provided that delivery may take place up to 90 days after payment is made, with a click-through to confirm customer acceptance of the policy before committing the order.

Well, @c1vhosting? When do you plan to make those very reasonable changes to your informed customer ordering process?

Thanks for your feedback

@emg’s comment/feedback ended with a question.

james50a

@Arkas said:
@c1vhosting should have some sort of consequence for this.

Why not new tag ie "sketch" as a beware for hosts who aren't ban worthy but aren't great

yoursunny

Thread will be moved to Offtopic upon payment of @BilohBucks.

MikePT

@c1vhosting said:

@emg said:
Nice to see that @AndrewSSD got the subnet they ordered. Having said that, I maintain that @c1vhosting is a business that is following deceptive practices. How many other customers fell for the deception?

Future C1VHosting checkouts should include an accurate, reasonable delivery estimate. Otherwise, clear notice must be provided that delivery may take place up to 90 days after payment is made, with a click-through to confirm customer acceptance of the policy before committing the order.

Well, @c1vhosting? When do you plan to make those very reasonable changes to your informed customer ordering process?

Thanks for your feedback

I have issued a warning due to bad practices towards a customer of yours. You don't seem to care much about the comments actually trying to help you improve your service. If you're doing business here then please at least spend time to respond to our members accordingly.

forgetm

@MikePT said: I have issued a warning due to bad practices towards a customer of yours. You don't seem to care much about the comments actually trying to help you improve your service. If you're doing business here then please at least spend time to respond to our members accordingly.

Would you please investigate whether this subnet is DIRECT OWNER? Because it is clearly not allowed on the topic, especially LET providers all are respects the rules.

angstrom

@forgetm said:

@MikePT said: I have issued a warning due to bad practices towards a customer of yours. You don't seem to care much about the comments actually trying to help you improve your service. If you're doing business here then please at least spend time to respond to our members accordingly.

Would you please investigate whether this subnet is DIRECT OWNER? Because it is clearly not allowed on the topic, especially LET providers all are respects the rules.

Well, not to defend @c1vhosting or anything, but as far as I can tell (correct me if I'm wrong), they didn't advertise IP space here on LET, so they didn't break this rule of ours

If @c1vhosting advertise IP space on their own site and a LET participant happens to buy some IP space from them and this IP space is resold, this doesn't break a rule of ours

The issue in this thread was the potentially long wait for the IP space, which seemed unusual (and the question whether the OP would actually receive the IP space in the end, which he did)

Edit: It seems that they did indeed reply to requests for IP space after all, in which case they would have a broken the rule cited above

forgetm

@angstrom said:

@forgetm said:

@MikePT said: I have issued a warning due to bad practices towards a customer of yours. You don't seem to care much about the comments actually trying to help you improve your service. If you're doing business here then please at least spend time to respond to our members accordingly.

Would you please investigate whether this subnet is DIRECT OWNER? Because it is clearly not allowed on the topic, especially LET providers all are respects the rules.

Well, not to defend @c1vhosting or anything, but as far as I can tell (correct me if I'm wrong), they didn't advertise IP space here on LET, so they didn't break this rule of ours

If @c1vhosting advertise IP space on their own site and a LET participant happens to buy some IP space from them and this IP space is resold, this doesn't break a rule of ours

The issue in this thread was the potentially long wait for the IP space, which seemed unusual (and the question whether the OP would actually receive the IP space in the end, which he did)

He did, I'm not sure the subnet is he owns directly or not, Because it was mentioned that he appears to be resell.
https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/comment/3478525#Comment_3478525

ahnlak

@M66B said:
@AndrewSSD take a look here:

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treatment/unfair-contract-terms/index_en.htm

I guess point 9 applies (I am not a lawyer):

"Terms which bind consumers even though they could not easily have been aware of them before signing the contract"

Which means:

"Contract terms that are unfair under EU law have no legal or binding force on consumers"

FWIW the key word there is "consumer"; this would appear to be a business to business contract, so is not covered by such regulation.

MikePT

@Armstrong @forgetm,

Fair enough. He didn't put in any offer, just responded to a request? Do let me know if I'm wrong here. Still, there's not much we can do, we've already issued a warning, so hopefully @c1vhosting will start taking better care of his customers.