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Why are the LEB Feed offers, posted in offers allowed to break the rules? - Page 6
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Why are the LEB Feed offers, posted in offers allowed to break the rules?

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Comments

  • I have kinda gotten used to Discourse over on HB, but each client side page load seems to require more resources than Half Life 1.

    I don't mind sticking with Vanilla.

    AnthonySmith is one provider I'd nominate to run it as admin. Mods could be non-providers if that makes people more comfortable.

  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    vimalware said: I don't mind sticking with Vanilla.

    Make as many communities as you like, but if you want to please everyone with forum software you'll need one for each person with an opinion.

    Thanked by 3jsg angstrom Wolveix
  • @jar said:

    vimalware said: I don't mind sticking with Vanilla.

    Make as many communities as you like, but if you want to please everyone with forum software you'll need one for each person with an opinion.

    Vanilla work nice

  • Forum software doesn't matter unless it's completely unusable.

    You can't force a community to grow.

    The magic of the best times of LET will never be recreated. There will be new, different magic, maybe it'll be better, but there will be no LET2.0. Move on, move out, move up.

  • @jar said:

    vimalware said: I don't mind sticking with Vanilla.

    Make as many communities as you like, but if you want to please everyone with forum software you'll need one for each person with an opinion.

    Precisely. I like neither Vanilla, nor Discourse. I am old-school, with love for phpBB, but nobody understands me.

    Thanked by 1kkrajk
  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker

    @default said:
    So... How exactly do you want to make LET better?

    For the sake of discussion (this is what boards are for) let's assume you are admin, and CC wishes to put 3 advertising flashy banners (top, left, and right) which will remain on screen when scrolling. How will you fight this and what makes you think they will listen?

    That's a very hypothetical question and I'm not well prepared to answer it because I haven't thought about it. But I guess I wouldn't change anything and if I'd change anything later I'd do it after a solid internal discussion and moderately.
    As for your "flashing banners" question: I would tell users how to get rid of them.

    As for "make them listen": Would you listen to somebody who obviously despises and fights you toes and nails? Probably not. So I would approach CC/Deluxe as an opponent but not as a hateful foe.

    But again, that's a very hypothetical question.

    @jar

    You are absolutely right. But: Next to the one who succeeds there are hundreds who failed. The way I see it LET is working, but there are nuisances (well, where are none?).

    I think AnthonySmith paints a nuisance as crisis. And there are other nuisances too.

    • My walls of text are a nuisance to some
    • Their "conversation" via images or gifs are a nuisance for me (I have eye problems)
    • The LEB threads are a nuisance to many
    • Some forum software problems are a nuisance
    • etc.

    Of course I'm p_ssed off by CC/Deluxe shady practices and scammer support. But I also see the real weight of that nuisance and it's not big, certainly not big enough to throw LET away and start a new and better (really?) "LET 2".

    Thanked by 2Trav jar
  • HERE WE FUCKING GO

  • vimalwarevimalware Member
    edited November 2019

    @jar said:

    vimalware said: I don't mind sticking with Vanilla.

    Make as many communities as you like, but if you want to please everyone with forum software you'll need one for each person with an opinion.

    Yes, I agree.
    Either go next-gen with HB/discourse (can it handle the user influx?)
    or stick with lightweight BB. ('stay on Vanilla' falls under here)

    Edit: also whatever doesn't lose data and isn't an administrator's nightmare. I don't know anything about BB software.

  • trewqtrewq Administrator, Patron Provider

    The value of LET to me is the people and the community we've all created together. So many people come here to socialise and the majority of the time people that lurk feel just as much apart of the community as those who post regularly. This isn't something I'm interested in taking away from anyone or myself.

    HostBalls is good, I enjoy it. This is mostly because of the people, the majority of which are also here. Go check it out if you haven't already, it has a different, calmer, vibe.

    A few ads here and there is a small price to pay for the amount of control and autonomy we get considering this forum is owned by a for profit business. If people are interested in them they'll read them, just like every other post on this forum.

  • angstromangstrom Moderator
    edited November 2019

    As I see it, there are really two issues here:

    1. the issue of LEB Feed offers, which is a recent issue and is nominally the topic of this thread
    2. the issue of how CC generally treat / interact with LET, which has been an issue for a long time

    Re 1: As I've said before, I personally find it easy to "tune out" LEB Feed offers: I barely even notice them anymore.

    It is, however, technically problematic that LEB Feed offers appear in the category "Offers", which is governed by the rules of LET, and I take this to be @AnthonySmith's specific complaint. A workaround would be to make a new category "LEB Offers" for the LEB Feed offers only, and this category would be governed by the rules of LEB. I think that such a category "LEB Offers" would address @AnthonySmith's specific complaint.

    (I doubt that CC would be willing to allow such a category, but since they don't respond to complaints or suggestions anymore, it's hard to know.)

    Re 2: This is clearly a much bigger and more contentious issue ...

    Thanked by 2AlwaysSkint FrankZ
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran

    jsg said: Their "conversation" via images or gifs are a nuisance for me

    Speaking of which, I was meaning to drop one in this thread.

    image

    Thanked by 2ITLabs ChrisMiller
  • Saw this coming is all I am going to say here.

    Thanked by 1ehab
  • i now have a feeling that this BF will be worst ever.

    anyway .. it is clear LET is a

  • trewqtrewq Administrator, Patron Provider

    angstrom said: A workaround would be to make a new category "LEB Offers" for the LEB Feed offers only, and this category would be governed by the rules of LEB.

    Good idea and actioned. All new feed posts will go into a new category.

  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker
    edited November 2019

    @trewq

    Thank you. I'm glad that we have a prudent admin who looks calmly at things. And I think you put it well.

    @angstrom said:
    It is, however, technically problematic that LEB Feed offers appear in the category "Offers", which is governed by the rules of LET, and I take this to be @AnthonySmith's specific complaint. A workaround would be to make a new category "LEB Offers" for the LEB Feed offers only, and this category would be governed by the rules of LEB. I think that such a category "LEB Offers" would address @AnthonySmith's specific complaint.

    (I doubt that CC would be willing to allow such a category, but since they don't respond to complaints or suggestions anymore, it's hard to know.)

    Careful there! CC/Deluxe might even like that idea because it would add visibility and prominence to their crap.

    If at all I'd rather create a new LET (non LEB) category, something like "above 7$ but very tasty offers" where LET providers can put offers that are above our price limit but especially tasty. The limit of that category should be similar to the real LEB limit ($10/mo? $12?).
    Leveling the playing field seems much more promising than leaving LET for some new alternative. But I guess that CC/Deluxe might not at all like that idea.

    P.S. congrats to @Nekki

    Thanked by 1vimalware
  • ehab said: i now have a feeling that this BF will be worst ever.

    Not if I've got anything to do with it.

    LET will be a ghost town when we're done because no-one will be able to afford an internet connection after so many deals.

  • @angstrom

    Is not just those LEBfeed offers shoved down our eyeballs, but also:

    • LowEndBox button bellow logo (clicked so many times)
    • Subscribe to Newsletter for LEB
    • Latest LEB offers (in right column)
    • Support still broken

    Don't get me wrong, I personally have nothing against advertising, but all this is a trend announced under the "nuisance" of Changes by Chris, which are implemented blazing fast (compaired to their previous speeds at doing something), while ignoring community feedback.

  • @trewq said:

    angstrom said: A workaround would be to make a new category "LEB Offers" for the LEB Feed offers only, and this category would be governed by the rules of LEB.

    Good idea and actioned. All new feed posts will go into a new category.

    Am pleased if you can do it. :smile: It would have the benefit of making a clean separation between LET offers and LEB offers, which I believe would address @AnthonySmith's specifc complaint. (He still won't like CC, but this is another issue.)

  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker

    @angstrom said:

    Good idea and actioned. All new feed posts will go into a new category.

    Am pleased if you can do it. :smile: It would have the benefit of making a clean separation between LET offers and LEB offers, which I believe would address @AnthonySmith's specifc complaint. (He still won't like CC, but this is another issue.)

    Have a look at my answer. I think that AnthonySmith and other LET providers would be better served if they got a category leveling the playing field. If we are the stage where $10 offers are acceptable (via LEB) then our LET providers should be able to play at that level too.

  • @default said:
    @angstrom

    Is not just those LEBfeed offers shoved down our eyeballs, but also:

    • LowEndBox button bellow logo (clicked so many times)
    • Subscribe to Newsletter for LEB
    • Latest LEB offers (in right column)
    • Support still broken

    Don't get me wrong, I personally have nothing against advertising, but all this is a trend announced under the "nuisance" of Changes by Chris, which are implemented blazing fast (compaired to their previous speeds at doing something), while ignoring community feedback.

    I completely agree with all of these frustrations, but they all fall under point 2 in my comment above.

    I was just trying to isolate and propose a workaround for a specific (legitimate) complaint that @AnthonySmith made.

  • trewqtrewq Administrator, Patron Provider

    @jsg said:

    @angstrom said:

    Good idea and actioned. All new feed posts will go into a new category.

    Am pleased if you can do it. :smile: It would have the benefit of making a clean separation between LET offers and LEB offers, which I believe would address @AnthonySmith's specifc complaint. (He still won't like CC, but this is another issue.)

    Have a look at my answer. I think that AnthonySmith and other LET providers would be better served if they got a category leveling the playing field. If we are the stage where $10 offers are acceptable (via LEB) then our LET providers should be able to play at that level too.

    For sure something to look at after black friday when everyone's pockets are empty and they have clear minds. Whenever we've talked about this in the past the overwhelming majority of people didn't want change. With the forced changes happening though you never know, might be what people are after.

  • @Nekki said:

    off course if you call it then it will be fun....lets see :)

    Thanked by 1FrankZ
  • so, are we coming back or not?

    Thanked by 1AlwaysSkint
  • @jsg said:

    @angstrom said:

    Good idea and actioned. All new feed posts will go into a new category.

    Am pleased if you can do it. :smile: It would have the benefit of making a clean separation between LET offers and LEB offers, which I believe would address @AnthonySmith's specifc complaint. (He still won't like CC, but this is another issue.)

    Have a look at my answer. I think that AnthonySmith and other LET providers would be better served if they got a category leveling the playing field. If we are the stage where $10 offers are acceptable (via LEB) then our LET providers should be able to play at that level too.

    If I may say so, let's try to keep the question of whether or not to keep the LET $7 rule for another thread. It's really not the specific issue that @AnthonySmith was complaining about in his comment, and I don't think that he has a problem with the LET $7 rule per se.

    Thanked by 1ehab
  • @tgl said:
    so, are we coming back or not?

  • no

    @trewq said:

    For sure something to look at after black friday when everyone's pockets are empty and they have clear minds. Whenever we've talked about this in the past the overwhelming majority of people didn't want change. With the forced changes happening though you never know, might be what people are after.

  • actually I think what @AnthonySmith is upset about is that he struggles to run a business while others are breaking the rules with those sponsored offers, and well, people cannot distinguish between normal and sponsored ones; including them in a separate category is a good start, but also if an offer does not respect the rules, it should be corrected or removed

  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Veteran

    ChrisMiller said: Is that how easy it is? If so! All I want for Christmas is to be a LET mod

    Get another 18,000-odd thanks to be in the same league and we'll talk ;-)

  • angstromangstrom Moderator
    edited November 2019

    @tgl said:
    actually I think what @AnthonySmith is upset about is that he struggles to run a business while others are breaking the rules with those sponsored offers, and well, people cannot distinguish between normal and sponsored ones; including them in a separate category is a good start, but also if an offer does not respect the rules, it should be corrected or removed

    Yes, but the point is that the LET mods don't exercise any control over the LEB offers, so the next best thing to do is to separate the LEB offers as clearly as possible from the LET offers (over which the LET mods do exercise some control). Getting rid of the LEB offers is not an option at this time.

  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker
    edited November 2019

    @angstrom said:

    @tgl said:
    actually I think what @AnthonySmith is upset about is that he struggles to run a business while others are breaking the rules with those sponsored offers, and well, people cannot distinguish between normal and sponsored ones; including them in a separate category is a good start, but also if an offer does not respect the rules, it should be corrected or removed

    Yes, but the point is that the LET mods don't exercise any control over the LEB offers, so the next best thing to do is to separate the LEB offers as clearly as possible from the LET offers (over which the LET mods do exercise some control). Getting rid of the LEB offers is not an option at this time.

    With my proposition LET providers like e.g. AnthonySmith get a level playing field and can run $10/mo offers.

    With your proposition our LET providers are still bound to the $7 limit, CC still runs $10 offers - but have better visibility -or- are "marked", depending on how one looks at it.

    I fail to see the advantage or even just evened out competition for our LET providers in your proposition.

    Also note that my proposition is within the bounds of our LET admins/mod, while yours touches CC/Deluxe "department" to which they usually react allergically. So it will only be CC winning with your proposal (better visibility) or at least be losing nothing (because they'll override our admins/mods).

    As for the "above $7" question -> that limit has already been broken by CC/LEB. So adding a category for our LET providers would not break a barrier but merely add an additional category where they are not at a disadvantage (which they do suffer now as well with your proposition).

This discussion has been closed.