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Another thought: "ONOZ! THE FRAUDRECORD GUY HAS DECRYPTED REPORTS THAT HOSTS HAVE WRITTEN"
....so what? Data is only valuable if there's someone who can use it. I'm not certain if anyone would have any use for the data.
@Damian Pretty much. If you went through all that trouble to decode something (rainbow tables I guess) you'd get...the email address used by a spammer? Something you probably already knew because if the information was relevant to you then you'd already have it? Now, I've always said hosts should exercise restraint in reporting. I've reported once, that's it.
To be more exact, it was mostly this thread http://lowendnetwork.com/discussion/comment/209911#Comment_209911 where I proved (directly with entered reports) how widely can be abused your database by unresponsible hosts (oh, abusive entries dissapeared after I posted links - miracle...).
Remember that record, if a host was truly stupid enough to have rejected a client based on that record, it was probably a host that you wouldn't have wanted to host with anyway.
It's a tool, not a direct-acting yes/no system. Proper/improper use is up to the end user of the tool.
@Damian It was more than one record by this same host. I also remember thread at LET when some random client complained about some host service and being right or not... another host suggested to report it to fraudrecord (solely based on complain abour service).
@Spirit The ability for a host to misuse it or abuse it is of absolutely zero relevance to hosts who do not. The host in question, I take all of their reports with a big grain of salt. Context is important. That's like saying that because someone else drives drunk and kills someone, cars are bad. Someone else abusing it is not relevant to me. I do not abuse it therefore I am not responsible for what they do. Their abuse is not relevant to my non-abuse. My use neither empowers them in their abuse nor assists them in any way in it.
That would make it even more obvious to not use that host then :P
I don't recall this (though I don't read every thread on here).... might be another host to avoid then?
@jarland was it don?
...and we've already seen an example where Corey Touchet of Front Range Hosting "accidentally" entered false information into the database which led to another host publicly stating on both LEB and LET that Corey's victim was an abuser/attacker/engaged in criminal activity.
Do you understand that a hash isn't required on the search form to get information on anyone. Enter a name, email, IP address, credit card number, domain name, in plain text in the search form and if any info in the database matches your search string you will get a full report containing all related information that has been entered into the database about that person.
If anyone wants a full list of fraudrecord members you can easily obtain it by going through the list of fraudrecord forum members (substitute the last number on this URL string, member numbers are odd numbers only and the lanast member number is 701 -note:many of the members are non-hosts just checking to see if they've been falsely listed in the database). Match the forum names up with the hosting companies and you have your list (many of the hosting companies who joined the FR forum decided not to implement this system, so membership doesn't necessarily mean the host is using FR)
The information that can be entered into the database by hosts includes much more than just name and email (Visa/Mastercard are going to have a field day when they find out some hosts are sending people's credit card information to an individual (not even a company) in Turkey without the cardholder's knowledge). It also includes credit card numbers, paypal email addresses, passwords, etc. The database is an identity thief's dream and it is handled by an individual not a company who little is known about other than he's a mod on a forum and "a nice guy"
name Client name.
password Client password. Usually a good indicator of identity. Security implications are discussed below.
company Company name which the client inputs.
email Client's email address.
address Client's postal address.
phone Client's phone number.
ip Client's registration IP address.
hostname Hostname for server clients.
accountuser Hosting account username.
accountpass Hosting account password.
domain Domain name of the hosting client.
payment Payment processor identification, e.g. paypal email address.
ccname Name on credit card
ccnumber Credit card number.
A sample record from the fraudrecord.com developer pages
Name: John Smith
Email: [email protected]
Secondary Email: [email protected]
Registration IP: 11.22.33.44
Password: iLoveLinux!
Cell Phone: +1 000 111 22 33
Landline: +1 555 123 45 67
Credit Card Number: 1234 5678 9012 3456
Domain: www.example.com
@Mun I file fraud reports about @halfeatenpie every week. I'm gonna laugh so hard when he can't buy his 400th dedi.
@jarland but that's your personal perspective. Clients may be lucky with you but that's not general rule in industry. Someone is marked without his knowledge. His name, home address, email, phone is on some bad reputation list available to others from same industry. Sometimes solely because "complain" he made or something similiar. And that's bad.
You... You... Horrible Monster. I'll get my revenge soon. SOON!
No it isn't. It's hard, indisputable fact. You tell me how that hosts reports amount to my using fraudreport in any abusive manner. Go ahead, do it. Tell me how his abuse means that I will or do abuse it.
Pfft, he's already signed up with every provider on the planet; you're too late.
He's already provided his name, home address, email, and phone to the provider.
Right, so you have to have the information to get the information. Tell me how this is bad. Tell me how it is bad that if [email protected] spams and only people who are looking for records of [email protected] will find a record that means anything, lacking any extra information, will find "this user was caught sending unsolicited email."
Go ahead. You guys are on a high horse here and you don't have a solid case about why I shouldn't be able to compare the hash to find out that what I often already suspect is true, that this person who is following the patterns of a spammer is, in fact, known for spamming. Of course the source has to be considered. I know these other hosts, I know which ones I trust and which ones I don't. If I don't know the host, I'll accept it as a mere "possible truth" or dismiss it entirely. But you tell me how my use is of any consequence.
Do these pages give away any private information? Nope
I agree with you here, but if I even accepted credit cards then I sure as heck wouldn't be submitting this information. Altering the module isn't that hard. Any host doing this should be exposed.
Isn't this question for you instead of me? You keep repeating that you entered only one name to this database. Fine. You're maybe more responsible host who don't feel butthurted everytime when someone disagree or complain regarding service. But should I, as client of plenty hosts and in same time vocal member of some community where I express positive and negative experiences with my hosts expect same level of tolerance and professionality with every host? It can be entered anything to such blacklist. Without person in question knowledge. But with his real name, home address, etc...
lol, but you can't pull that info out afaik
Every host I want to become client can.
No. It isn't. If you can find a record of me abusing it, you have a case. You won't find it. The information is so "public" isn't it? Go ahead and look. For that matter, how do you know what I'm doing on my nodes if I don't give you root access to the node so that you can see, unfiltered, what I'm doing? You have to trust me, or don't. You can't just accuse me of being abusive with zero to go on and suddenly I have the burden of proof. It doesn't work that way. Burden of proof lies on the accuser.
Yes.
Yes.
Absolutely. If you don't get that same level of tolerance and professionalism then you should shout it from the mountaintops.
I mean you have to put it into fraud record but you can't get it out
Not that I would need to anyway, since I already have it, as it was provided directly to me by the individual.
NOT EVERY...
I'll never touch shovehost!
+1 You shouldn't deal with hosts that act like babies.
But shovehost is good.
Well ofc, so its not telling you anything you don't already have.
Which is somewhat my point. Fraudrecord is a plus sign.
Provider 1: Already has client's information
Provider 2: Already has client's information.
So:
Provider 1
Provider 2
= Data
Great analogy, I don't understand what @Spirit 's issue is.
?
It's not about you personally. Infact I said "but that's your personal perspective. Clients may be lucky with you but that's not general rule in industry". I think that you messed up something or didn't read it enough carefully. I proved in one of previous threads and I linked it also above that hosts can and some of them will use database in unproper, we can say abusive, manner toward their clients. I am not sure where you found yourself in the middle of that...
He keeps making the point that any provider could write something terrible about any client, despite it being true or not.
This is a valid point, however, that's not a system issue whatsoever, that's a provider being a bad human being.
I wonder what kind of country he lives in that does not have the concept of credit.