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Rclone is one utility you can check
Hi @tomazu - Is the price different for the Singapore location once I migrate? Also just to clarifying was this offer recurring? Some issues with the support so thought I'd clarify here.
why should the price for SG be different? it's explicitly listed in the offer as option to migrate to. and for the recurring, so far all 10x10x10 offers had been that.
in anyway if the price would change along the way, that should have been stated in the offer post, otherwise I'd guess it would have been against the rules...
what's going on? can you share more info? so far I was under the impression, that webhosting24 had a very good support, but this sounds a bit alarming.
I confirm there does seem to be a bit of an issue.
My original order confirmation email:
How it now looks in the customer panel after migration to another location:
There was good communication to make clear that migration involves a bit lower CPU model and lower bandwidth, but no mention of the recurring price changing.
At the moment I am seeking clarification on whether this was intentional (and if so why it was not disclosed, can we revert to the original location, etc.) or if it is just an oversight which requires manual adjustment.
One of the users reached out to me here via DM stating they aren't honouring the price for Singapore. I opened a ticket for migration to Singapore and Tokyo. I opened it yesterday but haven't heard back yet. Although it's only been 24 hrs so not really complaining about response time. I'm concerned about the price not being recurring and the increase in price.
Which is not the case , when i want to migrate to other locations , Tokyo , I was surprised by the renew price listed, their support saying there is no 10x10x10 offer in Tokyo so they can't migrate as offered in this thread with same price.
In the end, it was provisioned in Tokyo with most closed spec as what they selling in Tokyo order page (with some more bandwidth) but it will be renewed as same normal price as what they selling right now in Tokyo.
so basically it's kind of not really real one free migration to other locations listed but limited location instead (somewhere hidden terms apply
). you can say it's explicitly listed in the offer but that's what i got. it will be renewed as round 28.8 EURO (if not wrong) / year rather 10 EURO as stated in the offer. hence it's one time discount but not recurring for whom want to migrate to some of locations listed above,
Indeed it's really disappointed me at that time as i was so excited to finally have one 10x10x10 in Tokyo. anyway in the end, I perhaps will have this vps for one year only, not ready to pay 28.8 EUR for 10x10x10
That should have been disclosed in the original offer before anyone made a payment with the expectation of relocating. At minimum before proceeding with a migration.
A subsequent post says that LET 10x10x10 can be moved to Sydney:
So there is nothing to indicate that doing a migration as described in the original offer would result in something other than a 10x10x10 in the new location.
I am not going to get too outraged before I get a reply to my own ticket, but will follow up after that.
Sorry for the wall of text. TL;DR What supposed to be a recurring offer of 10 EUR/year changed into a non-recurring first year deal with a silent price change of 28.8 EUR/year. No mentions about this in the initial offer nor before the free location transfer took place.
I am going to share my experience as well as my recurring price was too silently changed into 28.8 EUR/year rather than the 10 EUR/year as the initial offer was stating.
I love black friday, new year, etc deal threads especially when they're hosted by someone like @FAT32 and the entire community is hyped so I always end up buying a dozen or more servers during this time that I keep for many years due to the great offers but I never had buyer's remorse that would justify me asking for a refund or anything like that even if the host would allow that. If this is not some kind of mistake then it must be the first time I'm seeing what it looks like a seller remorse.
I was one of the lucky ones to grab one of the servers from this offer with the sole reason to migrate to a different location (Singapore) as it has been stated we are allowed one free migration. I was probably one of the first to request that free migration minutes after the server was delivered and I was only asked if they should migrate my data too or create a new instance in that location. I replied that I was fine with either of the two options, whichever would've been more convenient for them so they won't spend too much time on me. The server was migrated and that was it, by this time my recurring price was still at 10 EUR/year (remember this for later on).
A couple of weeks ago I renewed my Munich server for the second year (similar deal from last year bf) and that is when I noticed my Singapore VPS price changed from 10 EUR/year to 28.8 EUR/year so I've opened a ticket asking for an explanation and thinking it was just a mistake. Turns out it wasn't and I was given some excuses at first, then I was asked where did I see that the offer was recurring in the first place and then I was told that the offer was not recurring "any more". I wouldn't want to say that the ticket replies got a bit disrespectful, so I would rather blame it on the language barrier instead.
I've talked to some people here and one got a heads-up that a change in bandwidth and CPU would take place if he migrates his service (I didn't get that, but I already read it in the initial offer as it was mentioned and I was perfectly fine with it) but no change of price was mentioned in this case either. A couple more people's price has also been modified with no warning whatsoever.
Don't get me wrong, 30 EUR/year could still be a good offer but that's 3x times the price increase from the initial offer of 10 EUR/year. What bothers me is the way this has been handled, and I was eventually alright with the silly answers I've received so I've tried a different approach to have the remaining time for this server moved to my other service instead, which has the same price. Apparently, this would cost me 100 EUR in fees if I'd want it to be done, otherwise it would be too much manual work and I totally understand no one's time is not free but it's not me the one who changed terms midway.
PS: This isn't a rant and I hate drama and such, reason why I didn't even open a thread in the first place, although I was suggested to do that. I am still happy with their services and the network has been great for my current use, which is why I already renewed for a second year, although this happened before this mess. I recommended these guys before, especially due to their Munich location and I'd probably still do it but if you see an offer from them you should definitely double-check the terms of that offer and even ask them personally if the price is still recurring before placing your order while taking a proof of their confirmation.
I'm grateful for those who shared their thoughts with me about this situation, as I wanted to find out if I'm the only one seeing things this way or if I'm wrong and everyone else sees it as a non-recurring offer or first year deal only.
I panic-checked my Webhosting24 1GB plan, upgraded during BF2021.
It's still $13.52 in Munich, with 14 months remaining.
RAM is still tight, but it has routed IPv6 so I like this server.
Knowing that moving to Singapore would increase price, if you want Singapore, one trick you can try is:
Now you can enjoy the service for 10 years at current price, assuming the provider stays in business.
that's a bummer. I really tried to get one of these in US. maybe webhosting24 didn't see it coming that people only gonna buy for the migration to more exotic (expensive?) locations.
but I totally agree that changing pricing silently is a no go. stick to the offer or at least be clear before a migration, if that's been miscalculated and not possible at a higher price.
@tomazu what's your side of the story? ;-)
I know you're a guy who complies with european law, so you obviously know that you can't change things silently like you want to and without at least informing the client upfront. I assume you could have simply offered a refund instead, esp. on these loss leaders...
From what the post offer described right after the spec , the highlighted selling point was really one free migration of this 10x10x10. and no refund. that's why I said somewhere in the context there is hidden terms apply to revert to original price if migrated to (Singapore. Tokyo etc) . To be honest, without considering the price, this 10X10X10 is really a legend offer with the CPU and network, however the handling of this issue just made me feel the opposite way.
I will rather more concern if the company can last for 10 years than the price increase over night. you will never know you may be issued new invoice to top up price gap and your 10 years payment has no refund base on the offer stated.
If only we would've known beforehand, right? But we didn't and for sure nobody mentioned it in the ticket either.
I'd still probably not consider paying several years in advance, knowing the offer will not be recurring.
The Munich deal remains unchanged fortunately and it's still rock solid for me, this was all about the "free" migration from this new year's deal but the initial offer either had important elements missing from it or someone had a change of heart and thought customers wouldn't notice.
Over 24 hrs here with no reply.
Meanwhile, I got several more replies to my ticket with some more bs so it looks like you're being ignored. Oh, and by the way, canceling the migration is also not possible either, even though someone confirmed to have canceled his migration the moment he noticed the price change; he too wasn't informed about that.
sorry, I just noticed the tickets and thread now - my colleagues replied to the tickets in the meantime and I will reply here.
The price for Singapore, Tokyo or Sydney is not different once you migrate - the first year was paid in advance and of course we are honouring that.
But after the first year the renewal price in Singapore has been set to the plan most similar to the offering (as there is not LET 10x10x10 in Singapore). The LET 10x10x10 offerings are promotional and generally according to our TOS and the applicable law we have the right to change pricing after the minimum contract period regardless of location or promotion.
If I understand you correctly for at least two of you this is a major problem and you would never, ever ever have subscribed to that offer if you only knew in advance - you subscribed just because you planned on migrating from New York or Miami to an Asian location in the first place and you were never really interested in our New York or Miami offerings. Then the solution is simple: I will offer you a partial refund, no hard feelings.
To all the others commenting on this: We honoured all conditions and contracts; we did not raise prices over night or silently, the price for the renewal after the first year/minimum contract term (with no obligation to renew at that condition!) was adapted to the one of that comes most close in the region. We are allowed by contract and by law to raise (or lower) prices after the minimum contract period. Of course all customers are informed in advance and multiple times.
@falzo: I will soon have two LET 10x10x10 in New York or Miami available, so if you want one, just let me know ;-)
This forum really attracts drama for all the good and all of the wrong reasons, I tell you 8-) ! Have a nice week end.
Edit: Fixed a typo.
If it wasn't for this forum, would you have still offered this simple solution? Can you confirm that you already offered this simple solution to any customer at all that opened a ticket about this situation?
I see, care to show us where was this information being sent? I personally was not informed about this prior to migration nor through a newsletter, etc. Some people have been notified even about the hardware and bandwidth change in their migration request ticket, I haven't, but that's totally fine as I did read the offer and this is mentioned in there indeed. The shenanigans aren't though.
Do you agree that you should've mentioned this very paragraph "But after the first year..." in your initial offer and this would've erased any confusion whatsoever?
PS: There are other people who wanted a server but unfortunately they weren't as fast, those too had in mind to place an order due to this free migration offer so I'd say there are quite a few more that wouldn't have subscribed to the offer should they knew the price will change beforehand. I'm one of them, too.
It's sad but it's true.
Every recurring discount should be taken with a grain of salt, because the provider has the right to cancel the discount or raise the price after the initial term is met.
Hetzner did that, Online did that, and every other provider can do that too.
Similar, I bought a 🥠for $1 last month.
This month, the shop has the right to raise prices to $1.2/ðŸ¥, and there's nothing I can do about it.
On the other hand, I have the right to not renew the 🥠contract with this shop, and get my 🥠from a different shop.
yes, of course I have/our team has. Imagine, there are people who ask politely and explain their reasons and do not go on a public forum describing the replies given by the support team as "some more bs" etc. as the very first thing.
we send out reminders multiple times at least 60 days before renewal automatically; staff contacted, contacts and will contact all migrated customers. The pricing of the renewal is visible in the control panel at all times. You are not forced to renew at the new price or at the new conditions. Nowhere in the promotion did it say that it is recurring for ever ever.
We reserve and have the right to terminate your service after the first year/minimum contractual period. We reserve and have the right to raise prices or change conditions after the first year/minimum contractual period. And any provider I know of has those or very similar provisions. Please read the terms and conditions before purchasing.
no I do not agree. In the past @yoursunny has shown me things I could improve and change in our TOS, in our descriptions, in our setup etc. and I have incorporated that feedback and was very happy about that feedback. But from what I see in your posts I get the feeling that - as described - you somehow feel "entitled", you think you have a special right for an ever "forever" recurring special offer that is neither covered by a description, nor contract or law; yet you take for granted your right to not renew/terminate after every year etc.
Maybe we really read and understand things quite differently and that is why I offered you the partial refund.
But this wasn't my very first thing, was it? I already said in the ticket that was on me and I could've find a better wording as I initially wanted to go with nonsense rather than calling it bs but then again you and Markus have been contradicting each other in a funny way and the sarcasm was a bit off.
Fair enough, the word "recurring" is not mentioned in any of your offers but there are a few confirmations on your end saying the offers are indeed recurring. You never said they're recurring for ever and ever but who says that, right? Although, you never say the offer is "recurring" if you already have in mind to charge a different price the following year, correct? That's called a first-year deal, not recurring.
Do I look like I feel "entitled" though? Obviously, others have read that as a being a recurring offer as well so that's not just me. Do I expect it to be an "ever forever recurring special offer"? Heck no, there are plenty of providers who may go out of business till then but I kinda feel screwed when the price is silently changed without a warning and possibly I would expect it not to be a first-year deal too. I for sure wouldn't have placed an order if this was mentioned anywhere in that offer and the partial refund was not offered to anyone prior to people starting to discuss this openly in here.
I've been using Hetzner, Online and plenty of other providers that have increased their prices recently. See me ranting anywhere about that? Their recurring offers lasted for a long time and things get more expensive, so I totally get that, but the price was not increased without a warning shortly after my order. Bear in mind, the Singapore VPS was still showing the initial 10 EUR/year recurring price before it changed to 30 EUR/year and it was not changed right after the migration. I think you guys fixed that later on but it wasn't my case.
thank you!
no, actually for all locations except Singapore and Tokyo, the deals are recurring even after the migration. Again, please read the terms and conditions.
yes, that is what I see from your posts.
As described I have offered a partial refund, I hope that is acceptable for you.
thanks! ;-)
If you look at my history, I am certainly not one given to drama. The issue here is not what you are legally permitted to do. It is that users exercised an option you gave without the consequences being clear.
The basic facts: if we stay in NY/Miami, the next renewal is at €10. However, if we take you up on the "one free migration", we cannot renew at €10. Please say if this summary is inaccurate.
This would have influenced many people's decision to migrate (it did mine), if not the original purchase decision. Yet this was not made clear, and I am not sure how we could have suspected or found out the facts in advance.
You have not handled the situation well. At minimum, you should "own" the poor communication - it seems it was unclear for everyone, and clear for no-one. If you are not willing to honor the 10x10x10 in migrated locations (that's a legal/business decision) then it would be fair to offer the choice of a refund (which you did do) or migration to a location where 10x10x10 is available.
Instead, by saying that you are legally not required to honor anything past the first year (which is factually true), the take-away for those who signed up is that you haven't been transparent with them, and for everyone else is that your "recurring price" is not worth the paper it is written on.
For the record, I'm grateful to have a nice €10 VPS for a year and am not going into meltdown over this, but at this stage I won't renew anything with you.
OK, thank you for confirming at least that. I did nothing illegal, WOW - I am happy!
indeed, your summary is inaccurate, please see my short reply before this.
no - we are in fact honouring the contractual terms, you already confirmed that with your second sentence.
As described I am offering a partial refund to all customers that migrated for all services with us.
but you did mention the word "recurring" a bunch of times in your comments before, even in this recent one.
Bingo! We all know that now, but this was not mentioned anywhere in the initial offer, correct? That's where the confusion came from to begin with, this is what I've been trying to explain via tickets as well. That free migration you offered, should've come with this exact warning and all of this would've been crystal clear for everyone.
I think you're alone on this one though, and I definitely do not feel entitled to anything, but if you really want to use this word, then I guess I felt entitled to a fair explanation for the poorly worded offer that was posted. I'm going to accept the refund and be done with it, if there will be a next time I will know to double-check and get your confirmation before placing an order if the post leaves room for any kind of interpretation.
I initially wanted to offer the server to @Falzo but he won't be using Singapore as a location, good to see you're willing to offer him the recurring locations though.
Just one outside observation: how long was the offer available for people to read through the offer, the associated terms and condition and fill out the order form before it was all sold out?
Maybe it also has something to do that these are super limited too good to be true offers with complicated terms attached that might even be ambiguously worded?
I have mentioned it in the past - yes, it might all look good at first sight, but it will also cause frustration for those who couldn't get the deal and those who got the deal, but thought they got something else.
I feel left out :-)
I will have one more available in New York or Miami, so if you want it, just let me know @yvas11.
I have refunded @kalimov622, could you please send me your account ID/e-mail address via PM so that I can refund you, too?
Thank you!
I feel like the point of it being "too good"/FOMO matters far less when the new renewal price only kicked in after doing a migration (at which point you would've already received the product you initially paid for). If you didn't migrate specifically to either SG/JP, you'd keep the renewal price as the initial offer said.
Of course it is still problematic that it wasn't communicated in the initial offer that renewal price would go up for SG/JP, nor communicated in the tickets when the customer requested a migration. Something I'm sure Thomas makes sure is clarified for anyone that requests migration in the future.
Unfortunately, they don't seem to like it when this is being discussed in public and they may terminate your contract because of that and most likely blame the lost time on the customer so fair warning. I'm convinced he'll make sure there is no room for misinterpretation in future offers though and that's a good thing, but overall this particular offer was managed poorly with no options or alternatives given via ticket system until it was brought here for clarification. No refund was ever mentioned before that, or any sort of intention to work it out with the customer due to the confusion that was created. For me personally, it's a first and hopefully the last time too.