HostDoc Issues

SirFoxy

@Azenot said:

@SirFoxy said:

@Azenot said:

@HostDoc said:

@jackb said:

@HostDoc said:

@jackb said:

@HostDoc said:

@jackb said:

@HostDoc said:

I have noticed, you, Mike and a disgrunted Australian client are always the first in my dispute threads on the field for the client.

How about this, don't be so damn involved in my business. You have your own business, stay involved with that.

I will involve myself in whatever threads I like. This is a public forum after all.

If you hadn't released your clients name (fake or not - who knows) I wouldn't have posted. Don't like my posts - be more careful in future and I won't need to post.

You are welcome to involve yourself. I agree.
You just seem to like to involve yourself in all of my disputes. Even when I prove without a doubt there was no wrong doing.
But hey, involve yourself where you want. But never forget you also have your business that needs attention you.

In this topic we discuss your business, not @jackb.

@jackb fucked my goat

In the next time, he will offer you "fuck selektor": to fuck you or your goat. Ok?

A fuck selektor would be appreciated thank you.

HostDoc

@jackb said:

@HostDoc said:
You are welcome to involve yourself. I agree.
You just seem to like to involve yourself in all of my disputes. Even when I prove without a doubt there was no wrong doing.
But hey, involve yourself where you want. But never forget you also have your business that needs attention you.

So I was curious what you were talking about as I don't feel I've ever singled you out. I will call out behaviour by hosts that I personally feel doesn't meet the standard customers in the industry should expect. It is never targeted at anyone in particular, though admittedly I can be harsher towards people who should know better.

The only other thread I could find was this one below, where you made a mistake; I pointed it out and you said you can improve on that.

https://www.lowendtalk.com/discussion/comment/2931437/#Comment_2931437

And it looks like you have taken my advice - in this thread, you throttled him rather than powering him off.

I always take advice, listen to others and make strides to improve my business. That is a no brainer.

jackb

@HostDoc said:
I always take advice, listen to others and make strides to improve my business. That is a no brainer.

Good, so in that case we don't have a problem do we?

sanvit

@Lviv said:
@HostDoc, i have 2 questions

1) why a cybertech has a private chat conversation
2) what I did wrong and what you refused to refund me?

1. @dahartigan works for @HostDoc (support)
2. You were offered one. You refused it.

HostDoc

@jackb said:

@HostDoc said:
I always take advice, listen to others and make strides to improve my business. That is a no brainer.

Good, so in that case we don't have a problem do we?

I apologise.
I hate these type of threads.

PieHasBeenEaten

Alright well this turned out to be a fun one. Really we can agree to disagree with one another sometimes and that is fine. So everyone take a breath and move on. Plus I had a good feeling @Lviv pushed it to the next level.

Lviv

sanvit said: You were offered one. You refused it.

how, when? I was asked for it but why I would refused it, and than opened a paypay dispute?

do you have that secret chat log?

PieHasBeenEaten

@Lviv Dude you need to read the transcript posted and if you can't what is your native language?

HostDoc

@Lviv said:
@HostDoc, i have 2 questions

1) why a cybertech has a private chat conversation
2) what I did wrong and what you refused to refund me?

1) I have no idea what you are talking about
2) Read the transcript

Lviv

@dahartigan please post a full chat! not a part of it! this time a give you a permission

dahartigan

Unfortunately, the drama reactor has reached a point where the fuel is becoming poisoned.

The truth of the matter is the customer wanted to use the product for a purpose that wasn't conducive to a shared environment that is run by a man who is very focused on the performance of the nodes.

You have to understand that using 4 threads of an 8 thread (for example) host node for extended periods of time at 100% capacity each is not "good neighborly" behavior. That's mitigated usually by warning first, and then throttling if needed to make sure there's enough resources left for other paying customers. I'm sure you can appreciate that.

The customer was offered a refund when requested, he just had to open a ticket - which is the way it's always done at HostDoc.

Things got very complicated when PayPal dispute was involved, and it's understandably frustrating to be in the position the customer is in, and coming to LET is a great way to vent that to a sympathetic crowd.

OP will get his money back, the node will get its resources back and the Earth still spins around the sun. Happy days!

HostDoc

@Lviv said:
@dahartigan please post a full chat! not a part of it! this time a give a permission

How can we possibly post more if the entire transcript has been posted?
You also have the option to email the transcript to yourself which I am sure you did, so what else do you require?
As always, I am happy to assist.

dahartigan

@Lviv said:
@dahartigan please post a full chat! not a part of it! this time a give a permission

I posted chat number 2 of 2, I will post chat number 1 of 2 now. Stand by...

dahartigan

Conversation started on Tuesday, July 9 2019, 09:03
================================================================

[09:03] Visitor navigated to https://clientsarea.hostdoc.co.uk/
[09:03] <CUSTOMER> : hi
[09:03] HostDoc has joined the conversation.
[09:04] HostDoc : Hi
[09:04] <CUSTOMER> : what's your refund policy?
[09:06] HostDoc : We offer a 7 day refund for plans available via our site
Promotional offers do not have a refund guarantee.
If it is a birthday offer, that too will have a 7 day refund
[09:07] <CUSTOMER> : it's about today offer
[09:08] HostDoc : That would be my birthday splash then?
[09:08] <CUSTOMER> : yes
[09:09] HostDoc : Well, that is the policy. 
Was there a reason for you asking about it?
[09:13] <CUSTOMER> : yes, you gave me a worning after a simple(or not) test and i dont thik i can work with you, i dont like to be disabled at any moment.
[09:15] HostDoc : I did not give you a warning. I throttled you reducing your CPU to our fair share amount of 25% and disabling burst.
Disabling you would have been either an immediate suspension or killing your instance.
They are two different things. One is a nice way keeping you online. The other is abrupt.
[09:19] <CUSTOMER> : i just dont like to be disconnected for some tech reasons, this will harm my business
[09:21] HostDoc : Once again. You were not disconneted. If you were, you would have lost connection.
You were throttled. Keeping you online while bringing your CPU usage under control.
Any host who will allow you to use 400% CPU non stop and allow your neighbours to do the same will no doubt interrupt your business because the service is not usable and everyone is abusing.
We like to be responsible.
If that does not fit with your business then okay.
[09:25] <CUSTOMER> : i understand that i dont have 4 core dedicated, but shit happens, what if your CPU fair policy anyway?
[09:30] HostDoc : Shit happens??
Okay, lets take this scenario.
Your neighbours mysql 6 core instance runs out of control using 600% non stop and raising the load to 40.
The owner is unaware and the VPS is slowing down everyones VPS on the node.
Rather than suspending and taking his mysql offline, we throttle it and bring irt back within reasonable usage until the owner fixes.
The other alternative is immediately suspending for abuse.
Under your "shit happens", nobody on the node will be able to use it if your processes run wild.
If suspended, you will not be happy even though your processes were causing a problem for other clients.
As a median, we throttle, keeping you online and other clients happy.

You are free to go elsewhere and I will be happy to refund you as I cannot spend the last minutes of my birthday in a chat such as this. It is ridiculous.

vCores=25% is our policy with the ability to burst up to one hour a day
[09:36] <CUSTOMER> : i know that and i agree but don`t you have something like cloudlinux to limit the users on demand?
[09:37] HostDoc : Cloudlinux is for shared hosting and does exactly what I have been saying.
When abuse is detected, it throttles.
[09:37] HostDoc : That is what I do, I throttle/limit the instance while keeping it online
[09:39] <CUSTOMER> : ok, i'm fine whith  throttling for some time, just don`t disable me
[09:41] HostDoc : So long as you ensure your instance is secure and not compromised, throttling will also be our solution for abuse.
If you have been compromised, then to protect our network, you will have to be disabled.
So long as your instance is secure and no abuse takes place, we shall never have a reason to intervene your usage
[09:47] <CUSTOMER> : ok. i'm ok whith that lets see that happens next. But It's strange for me, it's my first conversation like this for 15 years, i feel like I'm on very shared hosting(((
[09:48] HostDoc : Welcome to the HostDoc difference.
We understand clients will need support, and offer instant support as opposed to send a ticket, wait a few hours for a canned and unhelpful response, then send again, wait etc.
With live chat, we can iron out any issue immediately therefore increasing efficiency
[10:04] <CUSTOMER> : i would like to keep those offers but i have have to know what is my limits, what i paid for. Can you give a full refund? becouse i dont think i can trust you whith my projects in this conditions
[10:06] HostDoc : Sure you can.
All refunds are minus the gateway fee we are charged.
I cannot continually spend 1 hour in live chat to be asked for  a refund at the end. My time is worth more than that so I will happily process your refund as soon as is possible.
It is now 1am here, so please open a ticket so your refund request can be tracked.
[10:08] <CUSTOMER> : my time isn't worthless too, and i spend more that you to be fair
[10:09] HostDoc : I'm sure it is. 
Please open a ticket for the refund and use the cancellation feature in your client dashboard to cancel the service.
[10:11] <CUSTOMER> : i dont know how to open a ticket, that was my first question
[10:11] HostDoc : Which I answered. Under the support section on the menu to the left if clicked, there is a sub menu with "Tickets"
[10:11] HostDoc : Click that
[10:12] <CUSTOMER> : there are  no buttons like open new ticket
[10:12] HostDoc : Click tickets
[10:13] HostDoc : It then presents the option to open a ticket
[10:15] <CUSTOMER> : i dont see that
[10:16] HostDoc : It is impossible to miss.
I do not understand how you do not see it.
In fact, open ticket is directly below support, no need to click tickets
[10:17] <CUSTOMER> : i will send a screenshot
[10:17] HostDoc : https://tawk.link/<SNIP>_Client_Area_-_HostDoc_Hosting.png
[10:30] <CUSTOMER> : ok can you just cancel this 2 services and refund?
[10:32] HostDoc : We need to follow procedure. You will need to cancel the service and open a ticket so it can be tracked.
You have wasted a further 30 minutes of my time asking for a button that isclearly visible without the need to look as is evident from the screenshot.
[10:34] HostDoc : I believe I have now answered all relevant queries and shall end this live chat that has laster 1hour 30minutes.
[10:34] HostDoc : Have a good day.
[10:34] HostDoc has left the conversation.
[10:36] <CUSTOMER> : will you refund or not? i was asked about it from the start
[10:56] <CUSTOMER> : ok . i have opened climes whith paypal
[10:56] HostDoc has joined the conversation.
[10:56] HostDoc : Great.
Now I can ban you wasting my time
[10:57] HostDoc : Your refund was always offered
[10:57] HostDoc : Read back
[10:57] HostDoc : Now there is an admin fee for fighting the claim for the gateway fee
[10:57] HostDoc : With this chat transcript alone we will win
[10:57] HostDoc : Goodbye

Lviv

HostDoc said: 2) Read the transcript

read the terms first, oh its not yours, from hostodo, read anyway!

Cancellations And Refunds

HostDoc accounts are set up on a prepay basis. HostDoc customers may decide to cancel their accounts at any time, however they will get a full refund of the service only if the cancellation request is made within 30 days of purchasing of the account.

To cancel an account, the Customer needs to send an e-mail or support ticket to our Sales Department and provide any authentication credentials requested by HostDoc. Other forms of cancellation requests will not be accepted. Any incentives (free bonuses, etc.) offered to the Customer upon sign-up will be also cancelled.

Domain name registrations/transfers, service upgrades and web hosting plan renewals are treated as non-refundable services (see below) and cannot be cancelled or refunded after being activated upon customer request. The Customer will have the opportunity to transfer his/her domain away to another host.

Late cancellations, as well as accounts cancelled by HostDoc. due to TOS violations (where the customer has decided not to fix the violation) do not qualify for the 30-day money back guarantee.

All credit requests for VISA, MasterCard, American Express and Discovery payments are processed within 48 hours of the submission of the refund request (by e-mail or ticket, as mentioned above). The funds will be credited back to the Customer’s credit/debit card and affect the Customer’s credit/debit card balance in accordance with the credit/debit card issuer’s terms of service.

All credit requests for PayPal payments are processed within 48 hours of the submission of the refund request (by e-mail or ticket, as mentioned above). The funds will be credited back to the Customer’s PayPal account and affect the Customer’s PayPal balance in accordance with the PayPal’s terms of service.
Non Refundable Services

Non-Refundable Services: all service upgrades, wallet refills, cloud account wallet refills and plan renewal services purchased from the Web Hosting Control Panel; all IP’s and 1-year or multi-year domain registration or transfer services purchased at sign-up or from the Web Hosting Control Panel.

All domain registrations and domain transfers are final, do not include any money-back guarantee and will be subject to a fee that is calculated on the basis of the actual NON-PROMOTIONAL annual price of the purchased domain’s TLD, multiplied by the number of years of registration or transfer. Any refund amount credited back to the Customer in accordance with our 30-day money back guarantee will not include the cost of the non-refundable services (if any) that have been purchased with the Customer’s web hosting plan upon sign-up (i.e. the Customer will be issued a partial refund on the original transaction if he/she has purchased non-refundable services within the web hosting account).

vimalware

It would be somewhat amusing if this all ended up due to some chat transmission payloads getting lost somewhere. (network partition /chat DB inconsistentcy)

Tickets FTW.

sanvit

@dahartigan said:
Conversation started on Tuesday, July 9 2019, 09:03

Isn't this the one Doc posted earlier?

sin

Were you running the unixbench part of serverscope? I always uncheck that because it takes way to long.

PieHasBeenEaten

Ok @Lviv can you read and stop posting please.

dahartigan

@sanvit said:

@dahartigan said:
Conversation started on Tuesday, July 9 2019, 09:03

Isn't this the one Doc posted earlier?

Yes, this is. I was asked to post it because OP believed it was not the full thing, which it is. Just wanted to make sure it's all out there, all I did was anything sensitive (customer's name and URL to a screenshot)

sanvit

Lviv said: the Customer needs to send an e-mail or support ticket to our Sales Department and provide any authentication credentials requested by HostDoc. Other forms of cancellation requests will not be accepted.

So which part of this did you not understand?

cybertech

Error 404
Intelligence not found

Coffee

Lviv said: how, when?

I believe somewhere between 01:36 - 01:56 they are waiting you to cancel the service and open a ticket for asking refund. It seems that you didn't do that.

Lviv

PieHasBeenEaten said: Ok @Lviv can you read and stop posting please.

read what? I will stop when Host Doc will gimme a full refund, he suspended the services and now that?

sanvit

@Lviv said:

PieHasBeenEaten said: Ok @Lviv can you read and stop posting please.

read what? I will stop when Host Doc will gimme a full refund, he suspended the services and now that?

Read the whole comments, from beginning to the end and point out which parts you think isn't fair or wrong (if any).

dahartigan

@Lviv said:

PieHasBeenEaten said: Ok @Lviv can you read and stop posting please.

read what? I will stop when Host Doc will gimme a full refund, he suspended the services and now that?

Since you opened a PayPal dispute, HostDoc no longer has your money - PayPal have it.

The process you started with PayPal means it will now take much longer to process due to PayPal disputes in the mix.

You will just need to wait now, as soon as Doc gets the email from PayPal to settle the dispute you will get your money back, but it will actually cost Doc a fee larger than the amount your service cost because a dispute was lodged.

It's a messy process, and it's complicated, but unfortunately the situation is a result of the PayPal dispute being opened instead of going the quicker, easier route of processing a refund via a ticket.

hardgamers

@Lviv said:

PieHasBeenEaten said: Ok @Lviv can you read and stop posting please.

read what? I will stop when Host Doc will gimme a full refund, he suspended the services and now that?

Can you read that they need you to open ticket for refund ? Not just chat, but a ticket...

But you not create a ticket, you going to PayPal for dispute...

Chat is useless for sensitive things like this, provider will never know it is the real customer or someone that pretend as customer.. but open ticket under your account will make sure that it is really you.. chat is for general question.

Lviv

sanvit said: Read the whole comments, from beginning to the end and point out which parts you think isn't fair or wrong (if any).

what is your conclusion, who is right? What did I wrong?

Lviv

hardgamers said: Can you read that they need you to open ticket for refund ? Not just chat, but a ticket...

nice, at the beginning I was asking how to open a ticket

sanvit

@Lviv said:

sanvit said: Read the whole comments, from beginning to the end and point out which parts you think isn't fair or wrong (if any).

what is your conclusion, who is right? What did I wrong?

READ THE WHOLE FUCKING COMMENTS. That's my conclusion. What did you do wrong? YOU OPENED A FUCKING PAYPAL DISPUTE.