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Thanks for the kind words. We'll keep working to improve, just wish smartermail wasn't so RAM hungry, but maybe I can find some .NET tweaks
Levi, or anyone for that matter, that has questions about cranes either for their current needs or later when we're doing domains are more than welcome to message or email. I'm still hoping to see some domains go up this month, but we need to get the site a bit further along
Francisco
Both are in Vegas. We only have 2 mail locations, the # just represents the node ID
Francisco
Appreciated.
Why?
Most of them use relay for outgoing, which makes them cheaper with bigger space + you can host your own websites + dns hosting. Reputable is hard to find, we just choose to believe which are, and which are not.
A lot of Direct Admin packages use mailbaby as a relay. In terms of money yes, this is pretty affordable.
I suggest you all try OpenSMTPD if you want a simple mail server for your domain. Postfix is very complicated, and Mailcow runs on Docker. Not everyone likes Docker (I don't). Would it make sense to create a tutorial and post it here?
No. Setting up a mail server isn't difficult. The difficulties are because other sites don't trust your machine to send them mail, and at that point it's irrelevant what software you're running on it.
Plenty of decent relays for delivery to choose from though.
We use MailBaby for shared hosting and have been experimenting with some relay options for our mail service, with the caveat that using them will require lower limitations than the comically large limits people here may be used to, but no one really needs hundreds of emails per hour anyway unless they're doing transactional mail or spam. (Neither of which is our focus)
Current reiteration is relying on MailBaby for that, too, but have enjoyed SMPT2Go and MxRoute as a failback choice for relaying outbound.
It's interesting because in my mind, tools like that seemed designed to send spam, so I'd have thought there was a higher likelihood of mail sent through servers that promote bulk mailing to be blocked by recipients... although obviously they're only successful in business if they actually reliably deliver, so I guess it must work enough of the time.
Unsure. All I know is that in the five years or so of using the service, I can probably count on one hand how many times we've had a ticket where someone was like, "Hi, my emails aren't going to a recipients inbox." and there was at least one or two times where the pre-loaded credit I put on the account was used up and the issue was billing related. (Don't worry, that was years ago, and the account stays topped up pretty well now and I have better email filters in place to make billing alerts like that prioritized for viewing in the flood of general business emails I get day to day)
I think most providers shared hosting services use mailbaby or similar, it's cheap and works well.
even mxroute use them
wait what? I thought that they had their own IP's?
Yes they have, they include it for the last resort i guess.. something like backup
Honestly, but then why would people use MXRoute then if they can use mail.baby direclty then?
I suppose that jar must have had bought the ip addresses but are the costs of ipv4 are able to reap themselves off with MXRoute and still turn a profit.
And if jar is renting these ips then even then I am unable to understand say very minor operation costs of 75-80$ for the ip themselves each month
in that much money you can send like 3 million messages monthly, I am not sure if enough messages are sent by MXRoute
My point is, if the reputation of mailbaby is good enough in such sense that even MXRoute uses it as last resort, then doesnt it make more sense financially to use mailbaby even for someone like MXRoute in some way or am I wrong about anything?
And does mail.baby have their own mails/ips or what exactly?
I'm speculating (I don't even know if they use mail.baby) but I would assume it is the other way. First it tries to go through mail.baby. That usually works. But if it doesn't they use their own IPs. Which means if mail.baby works, great. If not, they still get the message through with their own. So it is a level above mail.baby, and will work even if mail.baby doesn't.
Please let me know where we can get a /24 for that price. The cheapest I pay for a lease is 1000EUR per year.
And I agree with you partly. If you're technically inclined to manage a VPS, keep it secure, don't mind paying for a quality / reputable provider so it stays online most of the time, then you can install your own mailserver and have outbound mail route through MailBaby. Receiving mail is easy. Receiving only the mail you want to receive, in theory, isn't really difficult (Spam filters may need some tweaking)... MailBaby is only $1/mo + $0.20 per 1,000 emails so within reason for normal usage. But in that scenario you're paying for a VPS, and a separate invoice for a relay. You still need to update and patch the server as needed, and in-bound spam protection is going to be "stock" and still need tweaked.
With MXRoute and other companies, you just sign up, pay one (often small) fee for a crazy amount of resources (Like who the hell is actually using more than like 10GB of email storage? But everyone offers 100GB+...) and that's it. You set up your DNS records and you're good to go. You're sending/receiving mail using your domain and not worrying about things like server maintenance and stuff.
Just less headache, I guess. The expression, "Different strokes for different folks" comes to mind.
Oh gotcha, so firstly they use mail.baby and then secondly they use their own IP's
but now it raises me the question to all the people who said MXRoute is one and unique in their price point.
So if MXRoute themselves are (for the most part) just using mail.baby, from my understanding, there becomes nothing too much special about them.
I don't understand then to all the people who said that MXRoute is one and only thing at that price point. I mean alternatives shouldn't be so hard to get/create if all MXRoute did (for the most part) was use mail.baby, please feel free to correct me though but that's my current opinion
I mean 70-80$*12 = 960$-ish so I suppose that those aren't that far off I suppose, I had searched it on gemini to get a rough figure and it suggested me IPXO. I am sure that you know infinitely more about this space so I can be wrong but still I suppose that the ballpark figure of ip lies around this number
You are sort of right @MannDude about all of this but man, I always thought that Mail was a very significantly harder problem to solve so this all came to me as a bit of shocker
Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but if I were to design infra about something like this, I mean either I would use @onidel / @Hetzner_OL for the servers similar to how MXroute did.
I suppose that there are ways to optimize for something like this? Like using hourly billing solutions and then scaling up and down the storage as needed.
I mean, yes, most people wouldn't be interested in doing all of this hassle I suppose I completely agree with you on that, but I had always assumed that this was solving some immensely crazy problem of Mail which requires year to solve. I am a bit surprised to know that MXRoute uses a normal api themselves for the most part.
It shouldn't be that hard for other people to create an MXRoute competitive alternative. So in that sense, I am a bit surprised to see lack of competition in the area.
Basically gen X and correspondence. It's not rare to receive 10..20MB attachments.
I don't even know how much email is on my old yahoo. When the counter exceed 99999, I stopped looking, wait. Was it 9999?
Also, some corpos rely on them for communication since the 90s.
But MXRoute is better. Becuase even if mail.baby fails, MXRoute succeeds in delivering the message.
True but its not that big of a deal because if mail.baby fails you can try to use other SES perhaps even say Amazon Ses/Scaleway Ses, maybe even a single Namecrane account might handle those off-chance cases xD.
MXRoute is one all inclusive solution. What you're describing now is a mismash soup of multiple providers you need to manually setup to work with each other.
I am saying that creating something like MXRoute itself might feel mismash now but its certainly possible.
I am not advocating for an average person to do this so much as saying or maybe even realizing out loud that MXRoute alternatives shouldn't be that hard to be created while being price competitive.
just food for thought I suppose.
it's super easy, that's why there's 50 alternatives and none of us paid jar to do it. stop posting for a while man.
No, the one below is correct. First option is MXroute's own IPs:
IIRC, mail.baby (or some similar provider) is the third option to try if the first two were bounced.
But I also don't remember for sure, was reading that quite some time ago.
Try sending something to yourself from MXroute to see the originating IP.
I would say it's gen Z.
And good if it is actually attachment. I.e. they know what a file is and how to select/attach it.
More frequently it's an image copy-pasted right in the middle of the text, and good if their "AI-assisted cloud software" doesn't convert a 48 Mpix photo into .PNG
Also that copy-paste could be a screenshot of a photo opened in "Gallery" or similar app.
Okay now, I am a bit confused as to which way it is. I also believe it might be MXRoute's ip's first themselves because if not, then yea it becomes too simple which I don't think to be the case as otherwise yeah more competitors would be there than there currently are (essentially @NameCrane is the only decent one that I know of aside from shared hosting)
It would be beneficial if someone can clearly tell which way it is.
As someone gen-z I would say that most of my generation barely uses E-mail and sometimes i have seen it be used for sending files quickly but mostly, sadly I have seen most chats on centralized platforms like whatsapp,instagram, telegram maybe discord etc.
E-mail is mostly used for either responding back to some professional query or for OTP/verification purposes.
And oh btw 99.9% (my point being quite significant amount) of people use gmail.
I would like to add that this can be very easy solved using aliases and self hosting anonaddy https://github.com/anonaddy/docker. With this setup, email address leak poses little impact and no actual spam filtering is needed - the leaked alias used for a specific breached service could be rotated with a new one, and old being disabled for good. This way, no spam reaches your inbox and no actual filters tweaking needs to be done
No AI, fully natural intelligence, found 100% manually
https://docs.mxroute.com/docs/general/ip-reputation.html
Mail.baby is a backup (seemingly) after two attempts with own IPs.
Totally correct.
If you can, at least try moving them to Telegram - the only sane messenger these days.
If necessary, mention that it's possible to store files there and access them easily from all of your devices.
Tech-savvy ones can also send files to themselves (and others) with simple cURL request.
True.
I know a guy (not a guy actually, he's older than me), whose rather young daughter said she doesn't want a
her_first_name@last_name.tldinbox (the guy owns the domain), since "a free email is enough".I have moved one of my friends to signal. That was enough for me lol, most others cant be convinced so much but yeah, I personally prefer signal/matrix > Telegram > whatsapp.