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Comments

  • @forest said: My fingerprint is

    Can at least 50% of your recipient answer to you in the same manner?

  • @miniopt said: 1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    I was probably lucky and got a clean IP straight away. I guess you should not go with $7/y deal for this purpose.

    Actually, I tried it on another machine ($11/y) and the whole sub-net was blacklisted by Microsoft. I got in touch with MS and they said they are not delisting it and they will not say why....and this is final decision.

    @miniopt said: assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    I have not done tests but from DMARC reports I am getting, my emails are getting delivered to Microsoft at least.

    @miniopt said: 3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Maybe :smile:

    Thanked by 1miniopt
  • @hyperblast said:
    found this some minutes ago:

    https://pissmail.com/

    )

    Clearly the winner.

  • forestforest Member

    @JohnFilch123 said:

    @forest said: My fingerprint is

    Can at least 50% of your recipient answer to you in the same manner?

    My recipients? Generally yes, but I don't email a representative sample of email users.

    Thanked by 1tentor
  • TangeTange Member
    edited April 9

    @Francisco

    Hi Fran, i read on your page that your do not allow bulk mail and you have 600 per hour limit, i have a small forum, not big one, ~3000 members, can i use your service to send emergency mails to them? i can do like 300 mails per hour and finished in 10 hours.

    is that bulk mail?

  • @forest said: Generally

    What does generally mean in this context?

  • forestforest Member

    @JohnFilch123 said:

    @forest said: Generally

    What does generally mean in this context?

    Meaning that there may be times where I'm emailing a number of people who are not tech-savvy in the slightest, but the majority of the time, I'm emailing people who understand information security, privacy technology, and cryptography.

  • emperoremperor Member

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Its easy, get a relay. Its said hundreds of time here or on les. Do your search if you really want to know.

  • forestforest Member
    edited April 9

    @emperor said:

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Its easy, get a relay. Its said hundreds of time here or on les. Do your search if you really want to know.

    Some people don't consider that to be fully self-hosted. But yes, that does make it easier.

    Thanked by 2JohnnySac tentor
  • @forest said: the majority of the time, I'm emailing people who understand information security, privacy technology, and cryptography.

    This is good that they understand but do they actually care and use privacy technology?

  • emperoremperor Member
    edited April 9

    @forest said:

    @emperor said:

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Its easy, get a relay. Its said hundreds of time here or on les. Do your search if you really want to know.

    Some people don't consider that to be fully self-hosted. But yes, that does make it easier.

    Yea, good luck if you are starting now. Its just not worh the hassle. If you dont trust small providers with relay you have amazon.

  • forestforest Member

    @JohnFilch123 said:

    @forest said: the majority of the time, I'm emailing people who understand information security, privacy technology, and cryptography.

    This is good that they understand but do they actually care and use privacy technology?

    Absolutely. A number of them even work as developers for popular privacy-related technology.

  • @forest said: Absolutely

    Provided this is true, my sincere congratulations, you are in a very rare situations. My experience suggests otherwise, though - people do not care about privacy, use gmail/hotmail to store their passport/health data and are very happy because it is free, fast and it works.

    Thanked by 2forest tentor
  • @Tange said:
    @Francisco

    Hi Fran, i read on your page that your do not allow bulk mail and you have 600 per hour limit, i have a small forum, not big one, ~3000 members, can i use your service to send emergency mails to them? i can do like 300 mails per hour and finished in 10 hours.

    is that bulk mail?

    My question as well.

    Namecrane is one of the picks (and it has been for ages I just never got around to it as the need didn't need to happen... until now).

  • toftof Member

    Maybe ‘forwardemail.net’ is worth considering

  • toftof Member

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    I'm using 1-2vCore VPS of bero-host, greencloud, hostsailor for personal email service. The IPs are good enough( not in ban-lists). I can receive all emails in my personal inbox (Gmail, Outlook, etc.).[Maybe it’s because I don’t send many].
    You can install any Linux distribution you like, including SELinux.

  • forestforest Member

    @JohnFilch123 said:

    @forest said: Absolutely

    Provided this is true, my sincere congratulations, you are in a very rare situations. My experience suggests otherwise, though - people do not care about privacy, use gmail/hotmail to store their passport/health data and are very happy because it is free, fast and it works.

    Sadly the vast majority of people are like that... I don't talk to the vast majority of people unless I leave my tech sphere.

    @tof said: You can install any Linux distribution you like, including SELinux.

    SELinux is an access control framework like AppArmor, not a distro. It's the default MAC for most RHEL-based systems.

    Thanked by 1tentor
  • minioptminiopt Member
    edited April 9

    @emperor said:

    @forest said:

    @emperor said:

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Its easy, get a relay. Its said hundreds of time here or on les. Do your search if you really want to know.

    Some people don't consider that to be fully self-hosted. But yes, that does make it easier.

    Yea, good luck if you are starting now. Its just not worh the hassle. If you dont trust small providers with relay you have amazon.

    Call me old school but to me it’s sad if not infuriating to see that what Internet was meant to be is no more. By that I mean that a random, honest Joe can’t run a small mail server for himself, his family and maybe a few friends because spammers / scammers have ruined so many blocks of IPs, spam blacklists are ubiquitous and the big three or four email providers (Google / Microsoft / Apple / Amazon) use them.

    Honestly this makes me want to take up the challenge to self-host my mail server again just to tinker until I can get my mails through to the big providers consistently. But well, time is a scarce commodity.

    @tof said:

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    I'm using 1-2vCore VPS of bero-host, greencloud, hostsailor for personal email service. The IPs are good enough( not in ban-lists). I can receive all emails in my personal inbox (Gmail, Outlook, etc.).[Maybe it’s because I don’t send many].
    You can install any Linux distribution you like, including SELinux.

    Do you have some kind of high availability setup with the different VPSes from the providers you’ve mentioned?

    Thanked by 2WyvernCo default
  • forestforest Member

    @miniopt said: because spammers / scammers have ruined so many blocks of IP

    You mean because a few large email providers have a monopoly and use whitelist to kill smaller competition.

  • minioptminiopt Member

    @forest said:

    @miniopt said: because spammers / scammers have ruined so many blocks of IP

    You mean because a few large email providers have a monopoly and use whitelist to kill smaller competition.

    Yeah, that is a big factor of course. It’s just so egregious.

    Thanked by 2WyvernCo forest
  • mike1smike1s Member
    edited April 9

    I’ve been on NameCrane’s CraneMail product since day 1 (actually I was one of the first customers to shift all my domains to it during the early beta testing). It’s been excellent and I’ve also referred a few friends over. It’s just getting better with some of the projects Fran and Mike over there are working on. Reliability has been mostly fine other than a few blips here and there which Fran has smoothed out. I run all my personal and business accounts from it.

  • NameBigNameBig Member, Patron Provider

    @NameBig said:
    I'll be releasing an email hosting service very soon (1-2 days), with an exclusive LET deal of around $6/year for 15 users. Stay tuned.

    ~Vikas

    https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/216075/mailbig-net-email-hosting-6-year-15-mailbox-5-gb-space-mailbox-free-bonus#latest

  • emperoremperor Member

    @miniopt said:

    @emperor said:

    @forest said:

    @emperor said:

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Its easy, get a relay. Its said hundreds of time here or on les. Do your search if you really want to know.

    Some people don't consider that to be fully self-hosted. But yes, that does make it easier.

    Yea, good luck if you are starting now. Its just not worh the hassle. If you dont trust small providers with relay you have amazon.

    Call me old school but to me it’s sad if not infuriating to see that what Internet was meant to be is no more. By that I mean that a random, honest Joe can’t run a small mail server for himself, his family and maybe a few friends because spammers / scammers have ruined so many blocks of IPs, spam blacklists are ubiquitous and the big three or four email providers (Google / Microsoft / Apple / Amazon) use them.

    Honestly this makes me want to take up the challenge to self-host my mail server again just to tinker until I can get my mails through to the big providers consistently. But well, time is a scarce commodity.

    @tof said:

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    I'm using 1-2vCore VPS of bero-host, greencloud, hostsailor for personal email service. The IPs are good enough( not in ban-lists). I can receive all emails in my personal inbox (Gmail, Outlook, etc.).[Maybe it’s because I don’t send many].
    You can install any Linux distribution you like, including SELinux.

    Do you have some kind of high availability setup with the different VPSes from the providers you’ve mentioned?

    Yes. I agree with you 100%. Its just, old days are gone where you can DIY and would work. Big corps demand lot of things, and we dont have time to deal with that for small hoby or projects. My setup is online and ready for when i need it. Atleast they cant fuck us too much with incoming, so we can have control on our incoming mails

  • ralfralf Member

    @JohnFilch123 said:

    @MannDude said: The drama was dumb.

    Bear in mind not all people here are native English speakers or know English well enough to understand fairly basic grammar constructions.

    To be fair, as a native speaker I read "dumb forum (then x, y, z...) drama" as drama belonging to the dumb forum, then x, then y, then z. I also took it as a fair point, well made. :D

  • ralfralf Member

    @JohnFilch123 said:
    Actually, I tried it on another machine ($11/y) and the whole sub-net was blacklisted by Microsoft. I got in touch with MS and they said they are not delisting it and they will not say why....and this is final decision.

    You are not important enough, and with sufficiently few customers that are important to Microsoft who are going to kick up a fuss about not receiving your mails.

    If you were a large player, with a large user base then Microsoft might care more about delivering your mail. But then if you were that large player, you'd probably have your own IP block registered to you directly that wasn't on any blacklists.

  • LeviLevi Member

    @ralf said: then Microsoft might care more about delivering your mail.

    No. Even then M$ does not care. They only care about them-selves.

    Thanked by 2JohnnySac ralf
  • edited April 9

    Maybe https://migadu.com? (might not fit the price).

  • LeviLevi Member

    @TheGreatOakley said:
    Maybe https://migadu.com? (might not fit the price).

    Out of the question. Service which limits INCOMING messages are insane. And to pay for that? What they are thinking!

  • tentortentor Member, Host Rep

    @miniopt said:
    A few questions for people who self-host their mail server:

    1) how do you even manage to get a non-blacklisted IP in the first place, especially if you went with the cheapest VPS provider you could find?

    There are ton of blacklists but only a handful that actually matters, and unless provider has wide open 25/tcp or lax abuse handling policy, this shouldn't be a big issue. I wouldn't recommend using $7/yr VPS as a relay though, I consider email an important service so not cutting corners here. I host it on a dedicated server as well as some other stuff.

    2) assuming you have a clean IP with DMARC, DKIM and SPF records, how do you fare in terms of deliverability to Gmail, Microsoft, Apple?

    I have noticed that the biggest issue with most (can't say for all) freemail ESPs is lack of enough volume - if you send too little, no matter how good/non-spammy your emails are, if you dare to attach something remotely suspicious (could be even .docx attachment), they move your letter to spam folder.

    Compliance part isn't hard if you don't do mailing lists though, and if you do mailing list management software handles stuff like DMARC mungling, List-Unsubscription, double opt-in confirmation etc and so on.

    3) do you use memory encryption (AMD SEV-SNP or Intel TDX), run hardened kernels, isolate your services and use SELinux?

    Services are isolated but SELinux is an overkill for a single user machine IMO.

    Thanked by 1miniopt
  • tentortentor Member, Host Rep

    @forest said:

    @miniopt said: because spammers / scammers have ruined so many blocks of IP

    You mean because a few large email providers have a monopoly and use whitelist to kill smaller competition.

    Well, previously spam was frequently sent in a decentralised fashion, but after DNSBL cat-and-mouse game, spammers got lazy and in most cases just rely on the same centralised freemail ESPs, making it a good spam signal, unless some ham indicators are seen. Surprisingly, outlook and gmail are very chill on what they send and very restrictive on what they receive.

    IMO, what actually kills people's desire to handle mail themselves is other people's laziness and/or anxiety about email hosting (not only sending), leading to a delegation of this task to an aforementioned large email providers as a consequence.

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