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It is better to fill a DC while losing money than having a empty DC.
And miss all the fun? "You wish!"
Hmmm... shall I cancel my plan at Backupsy, as well? I had a solid belief your services are qutie reliable.
That was a joke regarding the "price > *" belief on LET. Our services are quiet reliable!
Thanks for reassuring.
As for price above quality, even at LEB there always is choice.
There are many offers here, some more expensive, some of a higher quality overall, not necessarily the two are in relation.
You can find cheap quality things and expensive ones that suck. This site's main purpose is to inform, to give the customer's an edge over dishonest hosts, to allow comparisons and stuff.
This should NOT be a provider's place, however, both parties should be honest. There are customers trying to destroy provider's reputation and hosts which try to lie and scam customers.
The magic is that both categories are cast out from here after a short while.
That being said, i still consider i was an exception, both as customer and provider, I am drawing some flack, I would say undeserved, but this will not make me not speak my mind, even when overwhelmed by the attacks, what I write remains and later we can see who was right.
Coming back to the topic at hand, I can already draw a conclusion:
Nothing will happen, prices will continue to go down and quality to increase overall, but not at the same providers.
This was obviously a special offer very poorly planned and, as I predicted, ended in a PR disaster.
OVH is doing many good things, I like the DDoS protection, it is almost exactly as i was thinking of it, but only a big provider can do such a thing.
They are also expanding a lot and investing heavily. This is a very good thing, same as with DO, these are young companies with lots of cash, can succeed greatly or fail badly, but in the latter case someone will buy them.
Either way, OVH is NOT a competitor for the LEB market the same way Carrefour is not competing with the corner store. There are customers for both, same people buy from both. Some corner stores failed, OK, but the others adapted, so much so that Carrefour here is for sale for some time and nobody is bidding since there are other similar hypermarkets on sale.
OVH is a competitor, since I as a customer of LEB previously won't be buying any more VPS while I can get a dedicated server for £2.99 a month. I know a few others who will be doing the same... I do like prometeus though as a LEB provider. But if there's a choice between dedicated vs a VPS then I'll always choose a dedicated server.
You are right, but not completely. What will happen most probably is this: you will buy a dedi from OVH, load lots of services on it, some time later get bitten by OVH and then come back here screaming and cursing:)
No issues for 1.5 years with OVH... lately even doing 15/25/30 TB a month of bandwidth on each of my servers. Even those which I bought as "5TB/mo bandwidth". Zero issues. But oh boy the VPS providers around here absolutely loooooove spreading FUD about OVH, it seems this has became their favorite weapon.
@rm_ well, you are right, i have no personal experience with OVH, i can only speculate. But you can see the changes in the ToS yourself. Time will tell how well these things will be enforced.
I've never had a problem with one of their servers before...
This statement should be printed in bold above the two threads on OVH.
The invisible hand of economics and business realities will do a much better job than FUD. Sooner or later you will find that out. There is never a free lunch.
If that's the case then one should be able to trust OVH. Established in 1999, familiy owned, classified as one of the biggest hosts in the world, building its own servers and datacentres, own world-wide network, own telecom company (adsl, sdsl, telephone provider).
Also had no issues with OVH in ~2 years, although not quite pushing that level of bandwidth. Quite amusing reading certain providers attack them though. Reeks of desperation.
There's no need in FUD, OVH does it itself with much efficiency. CHanging romotion terms en route and mass canceling already approved orders is a good example.
Also, personal experience awlays is most important. If you had no problems with OVH, well, congratulations and may you never have those.
I> @udk said:
I don't see any desperation but I do see customers trying to reassure themselves. As above stated, if it is working for you then great. Good for you. You get what you pay for still applies and always will.
The majority of complaints about OVH come from 2 groups of people:
the low budget Kimsufi crowd (composed of the same people who are the primary buyers of the 2GB/$7/more, more RAM LEB deals) who buy the Kimsufi line and expect a support team to hold their hand. The complaints about OVH's support are in large part from Kimsufi users. The support offered by OVH for the Kimsufi line is similar to the support offered by DireVPS or Waveride, i.e. no support for nonhardware issues. The "no support for Kimsufi" is also stated in the new TOS where it basically states "don't bother us by opening a ticket, go ask your fellow users on the forum if you have a problem"
WJunction resellers and LEB/LET (and HackForum) providers who buy OVH's cheapest offerings, have limited technical skills, and then complain because either OVH won't hold their hand or their account gets terminated for abuse because the clients they attracted were a bunch of spammers and skids. OVH is not a good choice for running a hosting company (it is one of the worst choices) if you take a lax approach to abuse by your clients.
I have 2 x EG Hybrid, 1 x SP Mini, 1 x Kimsufi KS-R8G (development server), and 1 x mKs2g N2800 (backup server) and haven't had any problems but I'm not trying to run a hosting company on them or an abuser.
I don't know, so far had no cancellation because of this offer.
As for the people which had good experience, there are always some which are happy with any service, they are just lucky, out of hundreds of thousands, it is impossible not to have thousands which were not singled out yet in years. The more customers, the more changes some will be lucky, even if the service sucks overall.
As for spreading FUD, lets imagine this is true, at 3 Eur a month, everyone will try it, even if every post will speak of bad experience, heck, some people never afforded a dedi and will be ready to sacrifice 3 Eur just to say they had one, they will eventually see for themselves. Therefore, any campaign against OVH by the "desperated" LEB providers is doomed to fail, the only ones that will succeed in this case are OVH themselves and, so far, they are doing a great job. I accept a lot of attacks by the people which do not understand some things, but to claim I am that stupid attacking OVH because I think this way will reduce the losses Prometeus will take due to their offers is preposterous to say the least.
That being said, at 5 Eur later, there will probably be a balance, 5-6 Eur is probably a sustainable price as long as they already have the hardware.
The only problem with OVH was poorly planned promotion. There's nothing wrong in their restricting availability to one region only. If that restriction were in place by the moment promotion started, there would be no problems with company image.
As for affecting low-end niche... I assure you that even if all the world could buy these servers, without restrictions on usage/quantity, it wouldn't affect the industry. All we would have would be a horde of people that can create a drama over $3 not refunded by provider they didn't like would become "happy dedicated servers owners", that's all.
Most low-end offers/similar promotions outperform these servers easily. Also, the mentioned offers often come with good support. And to those who can handle a dedicated without any support and can tune it perfectly - the loss of a Kimsufi offer won't make such people spill tears of envy or frustration. Or complain about the late refund of that huge sum of 9 EUR. "How did they dare to not refund immediately?!"
So the only attractive part of the offer is this is a dedicated server (oh really! really dedicated! you see, bro, how cool I am, I own a real dedicated server! bow down before a king!). Congratulations to all the happy owners to come.
Well, my supply of popcorn going low, time to get some more and continue to watch "teh drama".
Long before this kind of offers when atoms were above 10 Eur even, I was saying that small dedis are not worth it since a VPS will outperform them in normal conditions.
Up to 8 GB or so, I was saying then, a VPS benefits from fast raid, scalable CPU, 1 gbps port (some dedis have 1 gbps now), compared to ks they also have some support (other dedis do have support), run on newer hardware (usually) and are managed by someone who knows what is doing (usually).
Now, ppl posted benchmarks from KS, both atoms and dedis. I created myself an overzold 4g which costs 5 GBP (with discount will be 4.5), at max 50% more expensive than a KS 2G considering there is no VAT on it but with 4 threads and 4 GB ram, lets see how it performs.
# # # # # # # ##### ###### # # #### # # # # ## # # # # # # # ## # # # # # # # # # # # ## ##### ##### # # # # ###### # # # # # # ## # # # # # # # # # # # # ## # # # # # # # ## # # # # #### # # # # # ##### ###### # # #### # # Version 5.1.2 Based on the Byte Magazine Unix Benchmark Multi-CPU version Version 5 revisions by Ian Smith, Sunnyvale, CA, USA December 22, 2007 johantheghost at yahoo period com {snip} BYTE UNIX Benchmarks (Version 5.1.2) System: test: GNU/Linux OS: GNU/Linux -- 2.6.32-042stab076.8 -- #1 SMP Tue May 14 20:38:14 MSK 2013 Machine: i686 (unknown) Language: en_US.utf8 (charmap="ANSI_X3.4-1968", collate="ANSI_X3.4-1968") CPU 0: Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 0 @ 2.00GHz (4000.3 bogomips) Hyper-Threading, x86-64, MMX, Physical Address Ext, SYSENTER/SYSEXIT, SYSCALL/SYSRET, Intel virtualization CPU 1: Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 0 @ 2.00GHz (4000.3 bogomips) Hyper-Threading, x86-64, MMX, Physical Address Ext, SYSENTER/SYSEXIT, SYSCALL/SYSRET, Intel virtualization CPU 2: Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 0 @ 2.00GHz (4000.3 bogomips) Hyper-Threading, x86-64, MMX, Physical Address Ext, SYSENTER/SYSEXIT, SYSCALL/SYSRET, Intel virtualization CPU 3: Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 0 @ 2.00GHz (4000.3 bogomips) Hyper-Threading, x86-64, MMX, Physical Address Ext, SYSENTER/SYSEXIT, SYSCALL/SYSRET, Intel virtualization 03:54:55 up 5 min, 1 user, load average: 0.17, 0.05, 0.01; runlevel 2 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Benchmark Run: Wed Jul 31 2013 03:54:55 - 04:22:47 4 CPUs in system; running 1 parallel copy of tests Dhrystone 2 using register variables 11954493.7 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) Double-Precision Whetstone 1966.3 MWIPS (10.2 s, 7 samples) Execl Throughput 2326.6 lps (29.7 s, 2 samples) File Copy 1024 bufsize 2000 maxblocks 339381.9 KBps (30.0 s, 2 samples) File Copy 256 bufsize 500 maxblocks 88799.4 KBps (30.0 s, 2 samples) File Copy 4096 bufsize 8000 maxblocks 894984.5 KBps (30.0 s, 2 samples) Pipe Throughput 556015.6 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) Pipe-based Context Switching 66745.5 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) Process Creation 5855.2 lps (30.0 s, 2 samples) Shell Scripts (1 concurrent) 3967.8 lpm (60.0 s, 2 samples) Shell Scripts (8 concurrent) 1218.5 lpm (60.0 s, 2 samples) System Call Overhead 474429.2 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) System Benchmarks Index Values BASELINE RESULT INDEX Dhrystone 2 using register variables 116700.0 11954493.7 1024.4 Double-Precision Whetstone 55.0 1966.3 357.5 Execl Throughput 43.0 2326.6 541.1 File Copy 1024 bufsize 2000 maxblocks 3960.0 339381.9 857.0 File Copy 256 bufsize 500 maxblocks 1655.0 88799.4 536.6 File Copy 4096 bufsize 8000 maxblocks 5800.0 894984.5 1543.1 Pipe Throughput 12440.0 556015.6 447.0 Pipe-based Context Switching 4000.0 66745.5 166.9 Process Creation 126.0 5855.2 464.7 Shell Scripts (1 concurrent) 42.4 3967.8 935.8 Shell Scripts (8 concurrent) 6.0 1218.5 2030.9 System Call Overhead 15000.0 474429.2 316.3 ======== System Benchmarks Index Score 615.0 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Benchmark Run: Wed Jul 31 2013 04:22:47 - 04:50:47 4 CPUs in system; running 4 parallel copies of tests Dhrystone 2 using register variables 45371642.0 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) Double-Precision Whetstone 7713.9 MWIPS (10.2 s, 7 samples) Execl Throughput 10810.3 lps (29.8 s, 2 samples) File Copy 1024 bufsize 2000 maxblocks 424532.4 KBps (30.0 s, 2 samples) File Copy 256 bufsize 500 maxblocks 120492.0 KBps (30.0 s, 2 samples) File Copy 4096 bufsize 8000 maxblocks 1240254.3 KBps (30.0 s, 2 samples) Pipe Throughput 2062289.9 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) Pipe-based Context Switching 413208.3 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) Process Creation 17079.2 lps (30.0 s, 2 samples) Shell Scripts (1 concurrent) 10955.2 lpm (60.0 s, 2 samples) Shell Scripts (8 concurrent) 1561.2 lpm (60.1 s, 2 samples) System Call Overhead 1512277.5 lps (10.0 s, 7 samples) System Benchmarks Index Values BASELINE RESULT INDEX Dhrystone 2 using register variables 116700.0 45371642.0 3887.9 Double-Precision Whetstone 55.0 7713.9 1402.5 Execl Throughput 43.0 10810.3 2514.0 File Copy 1024 bufsize 2000 maxblocks 3960.0 424532.4 1072.1 File Copy 256 bufsize 500 maxblocks 1655.0 120492.0 728.0 File Copy 4096 bufsize 8000 maxblocks 5800.0 1240254.3 2138.4 Pipe Throughput 12440.0 2062289.9 1657.8 Pipe-based Context Switching 4000.0 413208.3 1033.0 Process Creation 126.0 17079.2 1355.5 Shell Scripts (1 concurrent) 42.4 10955.2 2583.8 Shell Scripts (8 concurrent) 6.0 1561.2 2602.0 System Call Overhead 15000.0 1512277.5 1008.2 ======== System Benchmarks Index Score 1633.1Looks like twice the ram and performance for about 30% average higher price.
Now lets try freevps.sh
The 1 gbps port is making a difference in many places.
For those that will point out this is only a container and the ram is not guaranteed, yeah, it is indeed a container and some very rare software will not work well, but about the ram:
Seems to have some reserves.
Pros for KS:
Unmetered traffic;
Upcoming DDoS protection;
No problems if load goes through the roof (well, your app will lag like hell, but OVH will not care);
Lower price (some 30%);
Will run almost everything;
Pros for OVerZold:
More RAM (double);
Better CPU (double if your KS has 2 cores, 4x if only one);
Better IO;
RAID protection;
Better network speed;
Some support;
Monthly payment;
Available for everyone, no matter location;
Will OVH chase our customers ? Some that need DDoS protection for sure, others, perhaps.
When the offer will open all over the world, even tho will be more expensive, more people will switch, but since we are almost all the time lacking stock, it is highly unlikely will make any difference.
EDIT: Damn, when will vanilla honour CR ?
Here is my benchmark at the Overzold 5GB :
That is fast network nice
Cons for OVerZold:
OpenVZ
since we're posting benchmarks, here are a couple from a 2GB RAM/2TB bandwidth/50GB pure SSD VPS (on an E5-2620) in the Netherlands which is costing me 25% less per month than a Kimsufi 2G and 66% less than an OverZold VPS (I'm paying 2.30 euros monthly due to a 50% coupon and a yearly payment). Same RAM as a Kimsufi but much better disk IO, and the processor power on this VPS is about double that of a N2800.
@Maounique : Cons for OverZold : You lack lottery in selection and provision of orders. You lack skill to randomly find a client to kick off. You are too boring that servers dont go down or get corrupted. You dont share your billing database. Support tickets are answered quickly, so we dont get the feeling of sleeping over the keyboard waiting for a reply. Your offer instant refunds, and we are losing our bargain skills. @prometeus tattooed loyalty by offering crazy discounts and now i can only be keep paying forever.
What a terrible service.
So, exactly what I was saying, contrary to what rm_ tries to prove, most LEB Providers should not be afraid of KS or OVH. While there are differences in solutions and they cant be compared on all aspects, that is even more of an argument KS will not replace LEBs anytime soon, presuming the 9 Eur/3 months offer stays, is available for everyone, has 2 cores/4 threads and is not really a lottery, you can get as many as you want and in the location that you want, you are not unlucky to get picked on by the automated tools/staff, etc.
So, the Maounique haters and OVH praise singers should first cancel their LEBs, then can proceed on their quest to prove they are right.
Failure to do so invalidates their claims.
I was thinking about getting one for backup, but went with Backupsy instead; I don't care about the RAID and network since it's backup anyway, but OVH is too much trouble with verification and waiting time.