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C1Vhosting - the fiesta continues - Page 3
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C1Vhosting - the fiesta continues

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Comments

  • @dev_vps said:

    @packetnext said:

    @dev_vps said:

    @Mumbly said:

    @dev_vps said: Lack of quality does not qualify for chargebacks for most cases.

    Wrong. Could you please refrain from making up stories, please?

    Let me quote it again (directly from PayPal url above):

    Buyers purchasing intangible goods (such as digital goods) and services can now be covered by Buyer Protection, in the same way as they are for physical items. If a buyer claims they haven’t received an eligible item or service or it was not as described, they can open a claim which PayPal will review. We want buyers to feel safe no matter what they’re buying.

    Services as described ==
    Services as per terms and conditions

    Now read c1v terms and conditions

    Good luck with the Italian court, the 16 year old wannabe business man and his Italian mom. I wouldn't read his terms and conditions, would be more interested where copied and pasted it from

    Who is willing invest that much time (and money) to go court over such amounts?

    Look around — we don’t see many stories about successful chargebacks from PayPal. And even in case credit card, not many cases where money is taken out from provider directly.

    Whether terms and conditions are original or generated by AI or copied from other sources, it does not matter. What matters is that terms are legally binding in that jurisdiction.

    Just fyi … c1v (or any other business for that matter) ownership could be structured differently.

    It could be much easier and time saver option to reach out credit card for chargeback who are willing to keep their (majority of) customers happy.

    disclaimer —
    — opinions shared based on experience. Not intended as legal advice

    C1V is Cynzia Tozzi company. Both IP's and media company is 1 company.
    C standing for Cynzia.

    Just type in Cynzia Tozzi C1V on youtube and you can see her fat ass.

  • MumblyMumbly Member

    sigh

  • crunchbitscrunchbits Member, Patron Provider, Top Host

    @dev_vps said:

    @sh97 said:

    @dev_vps said:

    @sh97 said:

    Attached invoices and ticket communications, they sent it to Xeroz for seller feedback, they didn't reply I got my cash in <2 weeks after opening dispute.

    I've also seen multiple MJJs chargeback with ease, so I think it's mostly successful.

    If the seller does not reply to chargeback case, it will be granted to the customer (default)

    There was a post here by c1v where he claimed that he never lost a paypal dispute.

    Imho, I find it hard to believe (C1V has never lost a dispute).
    Even reputed providers like @Crunchbits faced victimization from PayPal by MJJs.

    On the other forum, Virmach was also saying despite giving proofs, PayPal was always siding with the customer that he temporarily removed that as a payment option.

    There are certain circumstantial scenarios-

    example 1
    if 30 (just an arbitrary number) customers file chargebacks against a particular provider in 2-3 days, action is taken against the provider.

    is this fair? Probably not. At least, not without looking into merits of the case. But such things happen.

    c1v terms and conditions are extremely one sided. Unless such conditions are tested in a court case, these stay on a paper.

    Digital Services == Services as per terms and conditions.

    Things would change, if x number of customers write to European Authority that looks into contract being fair.

    Most folks lose small money and they simply move on new provider.

    PayPal has been (shockingly) quite fair with us. I just despise having to take 10-20m to properly collect all data, make screenshots and "A, B, then C" type of flowsheets to hopefully make it easier on whatever PayPal agent has to deal with mjj chargeback rage nonsense. My previous experiences with PayPal back as a broke college student selling miscellaneous small dollar stuff on eBay were horrific, which is partially why I tried to avoid using them but I also fully understand the trust/safety aspect as a buyer and think it's just likely a necessary evil.

    All of our outcomes have been:
    1. We just refund (because they were within the TOS and we would honor it anyways and we'd be likely to lose this by our own TOS, they just should have asked us rather than start a dispute).
    2. Contest, offer a partial refund that is usually slanted in buyer's favor because I'm too soft (every angry mjj has rejected these offers). Eventually win outright.
    3. A few cases where PayPal sided with us, but for whatever reason also didn't want their buyer pissed off so they refunded the buyer from their own funds while not striking us for dispute/taking the money. I assume they have some sort of spending metrics to come to this decision. Rare occurrence.

    All in all out of many many thousands of PayPal only transactions, total disputes have been extremely small in raw numbers. I just have 0 patience for it because there is no reason to dispute something we'd readily refund, and when you're a newer merchant on PayPal that rising dispute rate puts you into danger zone of getting your fees pushed up and costing a significant chunk of money for nothing.

    Thanked by 3maverick dev_vps Kris
  • shruubshruub Member

    @crunchbits said:
    PayPal has been (shockingly) quite fair with us.

    Hello, this is PayFriend support,
    Thank you for your feedback. We will be sure to a lot less fair in the future to keep up customer relations.

  • dev_vpsdev_vps Member
    edited March 26

    @crunchbits said:

    @dev_vps said:

    @sh97 said:

    @dev_vps said:

    @sh97 said:

    Attached invoices and ticket communications, they sent it to Xeroz for seller feedback, they didn't reply I got my cash in <2 weeks after opening dispute.

    I've also seen multiple MJJs chargeback with ease, so I think it's mostly successful.

    If the seller does not reply to chargeback case, it will be granted to the customer (default)

    There was a post here by c1v where he claimed that he never lost a paypal dispute.

    Imho, I find it hard to believe (C1V has never lost a dispute).
    Even reputed providers like @Crunchbits faced victimization from PayPal by MJJs.

    On the other forum, Virmach was also saying despite giving proofs, PayPal was always siding with the customer that he temporarily removed that as a payment option.

    There are certain circumstantial scenarios-

    example 1
    if 30 (just an arbitrary number) customers file chargebacks against a particular provider in 2-3 days, action is taken against the provider.

    is this fair? Probably not. At least, not without looking into merits of the case. But such things happen.

    c1v terms and conditions are extremely one sided. Unless such conditions are tested in a court case, these stay on a paper.

    Digital Services == Services as per terms and conditions.

    Things would change, if x number of customers write to European Authority that looks into contract being fair.

    Most folks lose small money and they simply move on new provider.

    PayPal has been (shockingly) quite fair with us. I just despise having to take 10-20m to properly collect all data, make screenshots and "A, B, then C" type of flowsheets to hopefully make it easier on whatever PayPal agent has to deal with mjj chargeback rage nonsense. My previous experiences with PayPal back as a broke college student selling miscellaneous small dollar stuff on eBay were horrific, which is partially why I tried to avoid using them but I also fully understand the trust/safety aspect as a buyer and think it's just likely a necessary evil.

    All of our outcomes have been:
    1. We just refund (because they were within the TOS and we would honor it anyways and we'd be likely to lose this by our own TOS, they just should have asked us rather than start a dispute).
    2. Contest, offer a partial refund that is usually slanted in buyer's favor because I'm too soft (every angry mjj has rejected these offers). Eventually win outright.
    3. A few cases where PayPal sided with us, but for whatever reason also didn't want their buyer pissed off so they refunded the buyer from their own funds while not striking us for dispute/taking the money. I assume they have some sort of spending metrics to come to this decision. Rare occurrence.

    All in all out of many many thousands of PayPal only transactions, total disputes have been extremely small in raw numbers. I just have 0 patience for it because there is no reason to dispute something we'd readily refund, and when you're a newer merchant on PayPal that rising dispute rate puts you into danger zone of getting your fees pushed up and costing a significant chunk of money for nothing.

    Thanks for sharing these details, @crunchbits

    Thanked by 1crunchbits
  • labzelabze Member, Patron Provider

    @dev_vps said:

    @Mumbly said:

    @dev_vps said: You won’t like this.
    Digital goods are not covered by PayPal chargebacks.

    PayPal has been covering intangible goods for almost a decade now.

    Buyer Protection now covers intangibles.

    Do you (or someone you know) have any first hand experience of chargeback for digital goods?

    I've had a few disputes by now with PayPal and the client has received a refund in all cases. There was a thread earlier in here with a client exploiting a feature in Blesta to essentially generate unlimited account credits. His services were canceled after initial contact to remedy this situation which led him to dispute his payments. Even though I provided screenshots of contact with him essentially admitting to using this exploit and my very fair dialogue with him PayPal decided to refund him in full. I called PayPal because that situation pissed me off, and their reasoning for refunding him was: I didn't submit proof that I delivered the servers. I did end up getting $200 as an "apology" for them.

    In other cases PayPal has simply just paid the client the amount disputed without subtracting it from my account.

    I really think that PayPal with services costing less than $5 aren't bothered checking any reasoning and just sides with the customer.

    It just stands to show that PayPal do indeed cover digital goods.

    Thanked by 3dev_vps maverick Mumbly
  • crunchbitscrunchbits Member, Patron Provider, Top Host

    @shruub said:

    @crunchbits said:
    PayPal has been (shockingly) quite fair with us.

    Hello, this is PayFriend support,
    Thank you for your feedback. We will be sure to a lot less fair in the future to keep up customer relations.

    T-thank you for your service.

    Thanked by 1shruub
  • JosephFJosephF Member

    If a merchant wins a PayPal dispute but the customer then does a successful credit card chargeback (after losing with PayPal), will PayPal then take back the funds from the merchant?

  • SirNeoSirNeo Member

    So many drama with C1V but my vps is doing its job very well.

    Thanked by 2tmntwitw c1vhosting
  • 1allen1allen Member

    but my vps is doing its job very well.

    +1 here, the vpn works well too. had the issue "your vpn appears to be disabled", contacted the support and eventually got it working.

    Thanked by 1c1vhosting
  • LeviLevi Member

    The saddest part is that community brings up real problem and provider just ignores it while sipping espresso.

    Chargeback and be done with this.

    Thanked by 1Svensken
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