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I'm happy to give you a test server, so you can check it on your own
Sure, we steal thousands of euros from our customers every day and don't provide any service. We've explained it several times, offered you a solution yesterday, implemented it and you haven't managed to check it again or contact us to find a solution. I'll contact Paypal tomorrow and suggest an amicable solution taking into account the time used - you don't seem to want to accept our offer to talk about it, there's nothing more to say here.
did you buy 200+ VMs from netcup all at once and use them just like dataforest?
The thing is, most of your customers don't use more than 10% of the CPU like a couple have stated in here. So they have never caught on and will never know if it truly is dedicated. Your only solution was buying business dedicated servers and I'm not interested in that. I can't do business with someone who says something is dedicated when it isn't.
Here is my solution. Refund me everything but you keep €300 since I used some of them for a few days.
So here we have:
No I didn't have that many. But I'm sure netcup has significantly more customers than avoro and I saw no issues on the ones I used. The hardware they use is also newer EPYC CPUs.
My expectations were what was advertised. 4 dedicated cores, dedicated ram, and a shared 10gb line. If the page said the cores were shared or "fair use" I wouldn't have ordered a single one because it wouldn't work for my use case. I had no issue with netcup and their servers have even better hardware for the same price.
How many exactly? let's compare apples to apples with facts. did you buy 10 VM at netcup and got a good experience but bought 200+ VM at dataforest and got a bad experience?
you forgot @Advin
Almost, you forgot about the part:
dedicated/do it , so we call itdedicated/do it too... and that is okey. (c) DataforestYou should grab a calculator and look at the real costs of your intended usage pattern. If it is not economically viable for the provider, then your expectations are not realistic, because it is unreasonable to expect that the provider will service you at a loss forever.
This is separate from the false advertising by the provider, and it is called due diligence.
Then they shouldn't advertise it as dedicated. For example hetzner also has these types of servers but they have shared cpu, and dedicated cpu clearly labelled.
Netcup has dedicated 4 cores with EPYC 9634 for €9.81. I used it for several months with no issues and I was using 20-30 TB of bandwidth a month.
Maybe I will sell a "cloud instance" advertising as a VPS, but actually a VDS, sometime in 2024.
A large part of the what the OP experience is because this community perpetually allows, supports and encourages the redefinition of established terms like dedicated core, especially permitted for providers currently in vogue... some people even run a quick cpu test and say look mum no steal so I do have dedicated.. nothing in their head considers that host cores > sold dedicated cores per node.. their brains segfault at this point.
A dedicated core should mean dedicated to you, our host node has 128cores, we sell 120 cores, each core you buy is dedicated/pinned to you. The same definition as used by AWS , Azure, GCP, Oracle, Linode, DigitalOcean on plans related to dedicated cores (and accordingly priced). What currently happening is that these bullshit providers make a bet that most customers, especially idling LET users, will never be able to use even a fraction of core sold, never mind 2x or 4x dedicated cores, so they make a calculated bet to oversell 4-10x and then will shuffle you about or play dumb with cpu steal.. ah must be temporary, a glitch, moved you to new host, remove some abusers, upgraded the host hypervisor, can you check now.. oh look mum no steal my dedicated core is back..
Currently a dedicated core mean jack shit on LET, it's basically nah we oversell like hell but you shouldn't see much steal, reach out to support if someone is stealing your dedicated cores..
I think this started with PHPFriends, and if you look back years ago, their bullshit definition of dedicated was defend by most of this forum, it will happen with current vogue hosts too eventually.
tl;dr stop using dedicated to mean best effort..
No.
Also, no.
I understand we all have a need to use big and complex words to sound smarter than the next guy, but let's not spread misinformation to attack businesses on things that we are clearly very misinformed about.
What exactly is big or complex? Do clarify your definition of dedicated where I am misinformed...
100% agree. It's amazing what gets defended as dedicated cores here. The illusion of a dedicated core because of a calculated bet that most customers will not be using their allotted CPU simultaneously doesn't cut it, especially when once they've rolled this dice they start searching for higher multipliers. I actually can't understand why these host don't just advertise best effort, many have great value propositions anyway in terms of managing available CPU compute (due to careful host management and live guest migrations we offer rare steal of shared cpu would be more honest), fast disk space, included network bandwidth etc..
This isn't our thread, so I am going to have to keep it short by clarifying that you clearly do not have, for the most part, any idea about what you are talking about. I wouldn't normally comment but you mentioned us, and then made up some other words to sound cool, so I was forced to point out your misinformation.
Our policy is pretty much this:
i,e dedicated is dedicated.
If you have a cough problem cough, feel free to open a thread, and add as much data as the OP added in this thread, documenting the steal that you see on our servers. Otherwise please spread your misinformation elsewhere and without our name in it, thanks.
i agree here, dedicated means 100% dedicated of whatever is offered unless its specified as "Fair use" or some % use.
I do remember reading TOS of some host which advertised as "dedicated core" vm, and the TOS contains a clause that for X minutes a day it is treated as dedicated core and then its not, that in simple terms mean they give dedicated core 100% usage for X minutes and then its shared/fair share usage.
I agree with the overpromising word. I ordered a dedicated server with a "10Gbps port" some time ago, but was not able to push >1gbps consistently.
It is advertised as 10gbps (and pay additional price!), but no phrases such as "fair share" or "limited use" on the website.
was told that I need to purchase a fixed bw price/mo after I reached out to them.
One lesson I have learned is this
— if I am looking for VPS with dedicated cpu cores, I will ask for clarity whether vCore allocated to the VPS can be used by other VPS under any pretext
@dataforest has already mentioned if cores of my VPS are idle, it will be used against other VPS.
I understand his behind the scene vps resource management, and it is likely that it is working for many.
But as a customer, I am entitled for full, complete and honest details so that my expectations are aligned correctly.
My two cents.
cc - @Nyr @labze @advin @hosthatch
They should expect clients using 100% CPU 24/7 , they are selling it as dedicated cores.
It's very simple.. Host node has X cores, have more than X cores for that host node been sold? if so then it's not dedicated, it doesn't matter if no one yet has witnessed steal, or that if steal is observed support will rapidly re-balance the situation, it isn't dedicated. And yet here we are, again and again.. I don't get the defense that within a particular price range the term dedicated core can/does mean something else, hijack a different phrase.
omg, shit again.
good morning everyone
[misunderstanding snipped]
I apologise for causing the confusion. I was simply quoting to agree with you about what dedicated should mean, and that it is the provider's problem to deal with, not the customer's, and the part after the quoted message was a continuation of my first message (not towards you).
Hope that makes sense, and sorry again since I do see my mistake in not making it more clear to whom my comment was toward.
The 'cough problem cough' part was how @vpn2024 chose to mention our name, which now he edited out from his post.
To be fair often times the actual throughput to various destinations is beyond the providers control but then i've also seen 10Gbit dedis sold by providers where the uplink for the whole operation was just be a single 2Gbit line and there was zero chance the client would be able to push 10Gbit to any kind of external destination and yet they felt that this is fine because the server had a 10Gbit card...
Borderline bait and switch in my opinion. Get sucked in by the cheap line that's oversold to the point you could as well not have the feature at all or switch to some more expensive product. On one side that's just how shared products work (at least i can't imagine the provider would have dared to claim the 10Gbit to be dedicated) but on the other hand there's a fine line between nature of the product class and false advertising/unfair business practices.
I see. If that's the case i obviously also apologize for the grumpy comeback. I've deleted my tirade. In my defense, i just woke up and didn't have any coffee yet.
Also, even if the CPU cores are dedicated, the memory bandwidth is still shared in-between the VM's.
There is a chance when abusing the shit out of most cores, you going to run into memory bandwidth issues, which will reduce your performance even further.
Not to mention the already lost performance when the Host Node gets loaded.
Used in the past for high CPU web scraping.
Felt oversold.
Another problem was their "anti-ddos".
I needed to connect to many proxies, and after 10 seconds, they disabled the network on VPS. Also, sometimes made a lot of connections to remote database and they "turned off" this remote IP.
Had to contact support everytime and they manually removed blocks. Finally dropped these servers and went to arm from another German provider.
Realisticly you have to agree with the provider in this scenerio, if a deal sounds too good to be true it is and you should talk to support about any questions, its almost obvious that the cpu cores wouldnt be pinned to the vms at this pricepoint, dedicated cpu cores is something debated against many providers still, I would classify dedicated cores as the vm having access to host passthrough cpu mode to allow full access to dedicated performence, maybe even cpu topology but thats a little much, anyway thanks for coming to my ted talk.