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Avoid Avoro.eu, php-friends, and dataforest oversold root servers and fraudsters
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Avoid Avoro.eu, php-friends, and dataforest oversold root servers and fraudsters

Hello. I'm writing this so that no one else gets scammed by the guys at avoro, php friends, or dataforest. They sell servers called "root servers" which they advertise as dedicated CPU and RAM. Here is the link: https://avoro.eu/en/rootserver/

I purchased 453 of the 4 dedicated core servers but added 2 GB of additional ram so it was 10 GB of ram and 1 6 dedicated core. When I start using them, the steal is insanely high. Almost 100% steal when fully using the cores.

I contacted them about this and they say that the node is dedicated and they made excuses, but then later admitted that they don't expect customers to fully utilize the resources, pretty much admitting that the resources are not dedicated. The steal on these servers is significantly higher than any VPS I use and have ever used and those are suppose to be shared while this is suppose to be dedicated.

What's even more crazy is they refuse to refund me. They only refunded me a small amount of servers which they did not even deliver. Yesterday I only had 226 servers which I paid €9.17 for 225 and €15 for 1. I paid them in total €4199.01 for 454 servers and they only refunded me €1265.46. Even after opening Paypal cases they refuse to refund which is crazy. Please avoid these fraudsters who oversell servers and lie about dedicated resources. I have attached several images of the high steal and them admitting the dedicated resources is a lie.




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Comments

  • AndruAndru Member

    453 VMs on a single AMD EPYC server, yeah this is a massive oversell for someone pretending dedicated resources...

  • JabJabJabJab Member

    Tagging @dataforest if they want to add anything, but seems like pretty straight out case and reputation down the drain.

  • AndruAndru Member
    edited May 28

    Doing a PayPal dispute will not help you... Keep us informed with PayPal decision.

    Thanked by 1GoodLeaf-Cloud
  • Drunk Mexicans and friends of scripting languages, what did you expect OP?

    Thanked by 2yoursunny Emoun
  • sillycatsillycat Member

    What the actual fuck are you doing with 453 such small VMs? You are obviously doing something shady that requires all those IPs; otherwise, you would have gotten yourself a dedi.

  • @Andru said:
    Doing a PayPal dispute will not help you... Keep us informed with PayPal decision.

    What makes you say that? I have proof of them admitting that the dedicated resources is a lie.

  • dataforestdataforest Member, Patron Provider

    Lets wait for our feedback, give me a few minutes ;)

  • lirrrlirrr Member

    oopsie doopsie oversell moment

  • edited May 28

    @JabJab said:
    Tagging @dataforest if they want to add anything, but seems like pretty straight out case and reputation down the drain.

    Yeah, while i think it's understandable they weren't able to just magically pull 100s of VMs out of their ass it says pretty much black on white that A] they took an order they weren't able to fulfill and B] the supposedly dedicated resources aren't really all that dedicated. I don't see how any of that would be the clients fault.

    Thanked by 2Mumbly TrendyJack
  • remyremy Member

    I was going to explain that since these are dedicated threads and not dedicated cores, performance may vary.

    But they seem to admit in their email that these are not dedicated, reserved resources. Good to know.

    Thanked by 1GoodLeaf-Cloud
  • AndruAndru Member

    @online7237 said:

    @Andru said:
    Doing a PayPal dispute will not help you... Keep us informed with PayPal decision.

    What makes you say that? I have proof of them admitting that the dedicated resources is a lie.

    I know but this is like how PP works. For my point of view you are qualified for a full refund...

  • TionTion Member

    This could be a case of misleading commercial actions sanctioned under general competition law in Germany.

  • edited May 28

    @Tion said:
    This could be a case of misleading commercial actions sanctioned under general competition law in Germany.

    Maybe. Won't be much help to OP though as only competitors (or customer rights watchdogs like https://verbraucherzentrale.de/) would be able to pursue a possible "unfair competion" violation.

  • DataWagonDataWagon Member, Patron Provider

    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    Thanked by 2BasToTheMax MateiSR
  • @remy said:
    I was going to explain that since these are dedicated threads and not dedicated cores, performance may vary.

    But they seem to admit in their email that these are not dedicated, reserved resources. Good to know.

    Exactly. I have one screenshot where the steal is almost 100%. It's significantly worse than even a VPS.

  • @DataWagon said:
    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    I thought these servers would be like the netcup root servers and they were cheap. I do have a lot of dedicated servers but thought this was a good deal since I only needed 4 dedicated cores. Even a VPS does not have steal this high. Steal on VPS I've used are 10-40. These ones were almost 100% at times.

    Thanked by 1totally_not_banned
  • @DataWagon said:
    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    Valid question. My only explanation would be either people lacking the skills to setup a virtualization environment of their own or bulk orders, while still weird, getting less scrutiny than requesting 465 IPs.

  • AdvinAdvin Member, Patron Provider
    edited May 28

    @totally_not_banned said:

    @DataWagon said:
    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    Valid question. My only explanation would be either people lacking the skills to setup a virtualization environment of their own or bulk orders, while still weird, getting less scrutiny than requesting 465 IPs.

    It's likely for some cryptocurrency project that requires a ton of CPU power/dedicated cores. We've also been seeing similar bulk orders and have been trying to distribute them across our nodes.

    Think about it. At Avoro, each VM is 9 euro with 4 dedicated vCPU cores. If you need 128 dedicated vCPU cores, that would be 32 VMs.

    32 * 9 euro = 288 euro for 128 dedicated vCPU cores, 256GB DDR4 Memory, 32 IP addresses, and 5.1TB NVMe SSD storage. It's far cheaper to rent from Avoro than to purchase a dedicated server.

    Of course, it's not nice to max the CPU in this way, especially if you're using a shared VPS with fair use cores. But if it's advertised as dedicated, I don't see why not unless the provider explicitly bans cryptocurrency projects or similar in their TOS (like Hetzner started to do),

  • DataWagonDataWagon Member, Patron Provider
    edited May 28

    @totally_not_banned said:

    @DataWagon said:
    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    Valid question. My only explanation would be either people lacking the skills to setup a virtualization environment of their own or bulk orders, while still weird, getting less scrutiny than requesting 465 IPs.

    The explanation is that they are trying to take advantage of lower price per vCPU on the base packages. We've seen a big influx of this recently, and it is also likely what OP was doing as well:

    avoro.eu lowest package - 4 cores, $9, $2.25 per core
    avaro.eu highest package - 14 cores, $49, $3.5 per core

    Most VPS providers structure their pricing like this, to give a decent amount of burstable CPU to users on the lower plans. It makes sense that anyone with heavy CPU bound workloads would simply purchase the higher tier plan.

    While it's not really 'disallowed' by many providers to do this, it's in bad faith in my opinion. We typically choose to not work with clients who try to take advantage of our offerings like this.

    We have plenty of resellers with 1000+ VMs with no issues, but when someone comes in and purchases 200 $6 plans and eats 50% CPU on every VM 24/7, we're simply going to choose to not do business with you..

  • @DataWagon said:

    @totally_not_banned said:

    @DataWagon said:
    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    Valid question. My only explanation would be either people lacking the skills to setup a virtualization environment of their own or bulk orders, while still weird, getting less scrutiny than requesting 465 IPs.

    The explanation is that they are trying to take advantage of lower price per vCPU on the base packages. We've seen a big influx of this recently, and it is also likely what OP was doing as well:

    avoro.eu lowest package - 4 cores, $9, $2.25 per core
    avaro.eu highest package - 14 cores, $49, $3.5 per core

    Most VPS providers structure their pricing like this, to give a decent amount of burstable CPU to users on the lower plans. It makes sense that anyone with heavy CPU bound workloads would simply purchase the higher tier plan.

    While it's not really 'disallowed' by many providers to do this, it's in bad faith in my opinion. We typically choose to not work with clients who try to take advantage of our offerings like this.

    We have plenty of resellers with 1000+ VMs with no issues, but when someone comes in and purchases 200 $6 plans and eats 50% CPU on every VM 24/7, we're simply going to choose to not do business with you..

    I only needed 4 dedicated cores. That's why I went with the 4 dedicated cores. I also have dedicated servers with hetzner, but with hetzner they limit how many you can buy and only increase it once a month after paying your invoice. Otherwise I would just stick with hetzner and netcup. By the way, netcup has similar root servers with dedicated cores and they do not oversell and the steal is 0. The problem with netcup is their root servers are out of stock.

  • @DataWagon said:
    when someone comes in and purchases 200 $6 plans and eats 50% CPU on every VM 24/7, we're simply going to choose to not do business with you..

    Well, for regular VPS that's perfectly reasonable. The problem here is the claim of dedicated resources. Dedicated resources pretty much imply being able to use 100% 24/7.

  • DataWagonDataWagon Member, Patron Provider

    @totally_not_banned said:

    @DataWagon said:
    when someone comes in and purchases 200 $6 plans and eats 50% CPU on every VM 24/7, we're simply going to choose to not do business with you..

    Well, for regular VPS that's perfectly reasonable. The problem here is the claim of dedicated resources. Dedicated resources pretty much imply being able to use 100% 24/7.

    Yes, that's why I lead my post with that. Definitely a no-no to advertise dedicated cores in that case. We advertise fair use CPU, so when someone does what I described above, they just end up gettin throttled. Just wanted to touch on the fact that we've seen a ton of people doing similar orders within the past month.

  • @Andru said:
    Doing a PayPal dispute will not help you... Keep us informed with PayPal decision.

    In my experience, PayPal sides with the buyer in such cases

  • @johndeo983 said:

    @Andru said:
    Doing a PayPal dispute will not help you... Keep us informed with PayPal decision.

    In my experience, PayPal sides with the buyer in such cases

    At least they should. OP basically has an official statement saying that he didn't get what was advertised. Paypal walks in mysterious ways though, so who knows...

  • lukast__lukast__ Member
    Thanked by 1hyperblast
  • lukast__lukast__ Member

    @dataforest said:
    Lets wait for our feedback, give me a few minutes ;)

    An hour passed...

    Thanked by 1totally_not_banned
  • @lukast__ said:

    @dataforest said:
    Lets wait for our feedback, give me a few minutes ;)

    An hour passed...

    Yeah, i'm kinda curious too. Will there be some kind of unexpected plot twist? As is it doesn't seem like there would be much more to say than "Sorry, we fucked up", which would be somewhat anticlimactic.

  • itsdeadjimitsdeadjim Member
    edited May 28

    2 shitty things happened at the same time:

    • they sold much more than they could offer (bug?)
    • they don't expect all customers to use 100% of cpu 24/7 (which is quite normal from their part)

    It's like all clients of a bank try to raise all their money at once. They can't, a bank has only a fraction of it, and this is why a bank makes profit out of thin air.

    It's not false ad, it's how the world works.

    The only problematic thing is not able to give a full refund, since the OP has a full right for refund.

    Thanked by 2BasToTheMax fendix
  • sameeramlsameeraml Member

    @online7237 said:

    @DataWagon said:

    @totally_not_banned said:

    @DataWagon said:
    Definitely no good to use 'dedicated cores' as a selling point when it's not true, but at the same time, why are you even renting their base VPS package for this type of workload? Wouldn't it make more sense to just rent dedicated servers, or rent a lower quantity of VMs with higher specs?

    Recently we've seen an influx in people who want to purchase 'bulk' quantities of our lowest VPS plan to run heavy CPU bound workloads, instead of renting the higher spec'ed VMs or dedicated servers.

    Valid question. My only explanation would be either people lacking the skills to setup a virtualization environment of their own or bulk orders, while still weird, getting less scrutiny than requesting 465 IPs.

    The explanation is that they are trying to take advantage of lower price per vCPU on the base packages. We've seen a big influx of this recently, and it is also likely what OP was doing as well:

    avoro.eu lowest package - 4 cores, $9, $2.25 per core
    avaro.eu highest package - 14 cores, $49, $3.5 per core

    Most VPS providers structure their pricing like this, to give a decent amount of burstable CPU to users on the lower plans. It makes sense that anyone with heavy CPU bound workloads would simply purchase the higher tier plan.

    While it's not really 'disallowed' by many providers to do this, it's in bad faith in my opinion. We typically choose to not work with clients who try to take advantage of our offerings like this.

    We have plenty of resellers with 1000+ VMs with no issues, but when someone comes in and purchases 200 $6 plans and eats 50% CPU on every VM 24/7, we're simply going to choose to not do business with you..

    I only needed 4 dedicated cores. That's why I went with the 4 dedicated cores. I also have dedicated servers with hetzner, but with hetzner they limit how many you can buy and only increase it once a month after paying your invoice. Otherwise I would just stick with hetzner and netcup. By the way, netcup has similar root servers with dedicated cores and they do not oversell and the steal is 0. The problem with netcup is their root servers are out of stock.

    I purchased RS 4000 G11 thinking the same. Initially it was lightning fast. But as days passed the YABS score got reduced gradually every day when tested regularly. After 3 weeks it dropped to 50% performance score than I got initially. I also noticed 2-3% CPU steal regularly since last week. Cancelled under satisfaction guarantee. I concluded that its not dedicated cores they are offering on a root server

    Thanked by 1dataforest
  • @itsdeadjim said:
    2 shitty things happened at the same time:

    • they sold much more than they could offer (bug?)
    • they don't expect all customers to use 100% of cpu 24/7 (which is quite normal from their part)

    It's like all clients of a bank try to raise all their money at once. They can't, a bank has only a fraction of it, and this is why a bank makes profit out of thin air.

    It's not false ad, it's how the world works.

    The only problematic thing is not able to give a full refund, since the OP has a full right for refund.

    They sell a product on their website that says VPS and the resources are shared.
    https://avoro.eu/en/vps/
    Why create another product and advertise it as dedicated when the resources are not dedicated? That's false advertising and fraud.

    Thanked by 1yoursunny
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