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BuyVM Problem
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
You know, some months it kinda feels that way when we look through our abuse tickets. You'd be amazed how often someone gets upset with us because they can't " 'stress test' their 'friends' site" or things like that.
As I said, I apologize for Anthony calling you a fraud or whatever, but the things he's been through with clients? I can't fault him for it.
Francisco
I'll put in all the time needed to resolve the case or to at least help them understand things.
Maybe I need to spiff up the front page more to make the 'contact us' button a little more obvious. I was pretty sure it was easy enough to find but it doesn't seem to be
Francisco
You're not running a day-care. He's an employee.
@travisapple Says the guy who doesn't read and doesn't want to read the binding contracts he agrees to.
Yes if only we could have taken care of all of this in a ticket. That would have been ideal.
Man you should see the tickets we get or the requests on IRC - you'd take back that day-care comment.
Francisco
@Francisco I suggest making the contact page actually be named 'contact' in the navigation bar, this way it would be more obvious
I guess, but the section covers more than just the contact details
I'm likely getting the front site overhauled.
Francisco
@Francisco Well that page only has contact info (as far as I see): client portal link, email, physical address, hours of operation for tickets, IRC
Testimonials in the top right
Francisco
@Francisco oh right. maybe have it be on its own page, called "reviews" on the nav bar, but it might actually get too cluttered
EDIT: you could also get "irc chat" down to "irc". also the testimonial titled "They mostly don't bite. Mostly." doesn't give that good of an impression :P
That's the point, it's hilarious :P There's lots of jokes and such tucked between all of our pages.
Anyways, this is way off topic so @liam could you please close this if Travis doesn't have anything else to bring up? I've done about as much as I can for him.
Francisco
No, I would not. I've run services (not for hosting, something else) like this in the past and have done his job. Rule #1 for a dispute is NEVER cut off private communication with them. They have no alternative but to take it public to try and resolve the issue. That he not only did this but you approved of it still blows my mind.
Where did they do this? Your account is still active and, as far as I know, points to your @gmail.com now. The email swap happened during the merge so the only fault the guys can take in this is that the TOS email was sent to the @d* email and not the gmail.
At no point has there been any sort of cut of communication. Our IRC is always open, as is our ticketing system.
You understand your account is still fully active right?
Francisco
Short of giving me a full refund. Fair enough. Close it.
Granted, today I have not checked it. On Jan 12th when this happened it was certainly closed.
Wrong.
The accounts were merged on the spot. The account is still active to this day and was never closed.
Are you seriously going to try to hold this all against us because you didn't have access to your own email during ordering nor did you read any sort of agreements?
Francisco
Take a moment to look at things from your customer's standpoint. I had a conversation in a ticket where I was accused of fraud. I try to log in later and see that my password doesn't work. I try to reset my password but it says there is no account on file with my email. I get no other communication at that time. I have no emails from your company other than the one I copied at the top of this thread. Nothing in my spam box. You've got a couple serious systemic problems on your hands and all I get is accusations and jokes.
I'm done with this thread. This will be my last post here.
I can't do much to solve PEBKAC issues.
Francisco
You massively oversell your nodes and have a no refunds policy. Your entire business is based on fooling people into giving you money, and having them cancel their service (or just letting the VM sit unused) in order to oversell the node more. The yearlies will never get any of their money back, and the monthlies only used their VM for a week at most, so you haven't lost anything anyway (just gained).
I'm not quite sure why you would even attempt to comment on the practices of another host.
To the other retards who are going on about BuyVM backstabbing their customers or whatever other bullshit, go get some service with your local cable or phone company, don't pay your bills, then try to get more service later. Tell me what happens.
I don't even like BuyVM, but this entire thread is retarded. They should not have taken the money from the PayPal charge, as someone else said above, but they did (and as far as I know, any of the big boys would do the same, if they caught customers doing this). If dude agrees that he owed the money (and he does owe the money), and doesn't even want a refund right now, go ahead and keep it. If he does want a refund, even now, I suggest you give him one and send him another invoice, weekly, until he pays it, because PayPal will side with him in a dispute.
I do read the ToS for every service I use, because I want to keep using the service. It doesn't matter what the cost is, because if I'm using the service, that means I either need it or prefer it to other services.
Products don't have terms of service, though software often comes with a type of ToS, a EULA. I generally don't read those because they wouldn't hold up in a court of law, and also because software is pretty straightforward in what it can do.
For me, this is the crux of the issue. Let's keep in mind that BuyVM accused the client of fraud, and not the other way around...
Having multiple accounts, anywhere, is not necessarily fraud. I have multiple accounts with my bank. I have two accounts with some VPS providers -- one personal, another business. This is not fraud.
The OP either forgot, or willfully ignored, the fact that he had an overdue invoice. In either case, it's negligence. Negligence is not fraud. I'll repeat that: negligence is not fraud.
IMO, BuyVM should have deducted the outstanding amount from the new payment, and then adjusted the expiry date of the new service appropriately. That is equivalent to you bank analogy, where the bank moves funds between accounts to cover outstanding debts.
Or @travisapple just didn't check his e-mails.
The OP logged into the account with the overdue invoice and tried to order a new service but couldn't because of the outstanding invoice.
He then went and created another account to order another service. This to me seems like it can be fraud.
I think this might be the best route to go. They could even add something to their TOS that says they do this. I'd still keep the $15 fine though.
This is probably what we'll adjust the policy to come closer to.
Ald's just trying to think of the best way to handle the WHMCS side of things if someone pays annually as the OP did.
Francisco
I learned this while working support for a large company for years. You just have to accept people will usually have anything but logic when it comes to corresponding with you when they're in the wrong.
I.E: Not reading the terms, not having access to their email, forgetting they had an account (or 3) but... it's clearly the hosts fault.
Sad how a few lesser hosts chime in on the issue to start problems. Thoughts guys: How about you focus on your own companies, like uptime monitors. Or in another case, your spelling & grammar.
In the end, you'll try to help, they will snap back and complain about another reason you're wrong. Zero–sum game.
My sides.
Here's the REAL problem. BuyVM actually monitors traffic! I was in the middle of moving abnormally large amounts of data from my BuyVM and Aldryic blocked me! How dare they pay attention to suspicious network activity!
**** DISCLAIMER: I'm obviously not really upset about this (although Aldryic did think I was some kind of amateur booter and now I'm going to cry myself to sleep)****
@Francisco wins. He did everything he is allowed to in the TOS. You agreed to TOS on order, so you violate, you face the fees.
**** DISCLAIMER: I hate disclaimers****