Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!


Hostigation 'Support'?
New on LowEndTalk? Please Register and read our Community Rules.

All new Registrations are manually reviewed and approved, so a short delay after registration may occur before your account becomes active.

Hostigation 'Support'?

I have had a vps with hostigation for almost 2 years now. Recently I've been having more and more issues with packet loss (I have been using it for a teamspeak server, so this causes roboting about once every hour or two). Today, for the third time in the last 2 years I got null routed for 'DDosing'. Now my teamspeak server has about 5 people on it at the most, and I host a single static webpage with rules. So I don't know who they think keeps ddosing me, but whatever.

So I email them asking for a refund or too forward me too someone else who can help. And I get quite the response back.

My email:
"Hello,

Since you won't allow me to use your services I have moved to another provider. This is the second or third time you have null routed me, and quite frankly I'm sick of it. I use the VPS to run a teamspeak server for about 5 people. It has an nginx webserver that serves one static page. If you can't host that, I no longer wish to remain with you.

Please refund me the remaining time on my account, or forward me to someone who can.

Thank you,
Ryan Quinn"

His 'response':
"There are no refunds, and whatever you are doing is attracking DDoS attacks, so look in the mirror if you want someone to be pissed at

Tim Flavin
Hostigation.com
Like us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/hostigation.hosting
Follow on Twitter @hostigation"

So um yeah. I'm not going to renew with them. Wouldn't recommend them to anyone else either.

«1

Comments

  • shovenoseshovenose Member, Host Rep

    There is no time to dick around in low end market. Tim's response is the only one that makes sense. It doesn't matter whether you host one static page or an entire search engine off your VPS, you could attrack/create DDoS at any time. Or your server could be misconfigured and thus creating NTP or DNS amplification attacks.

  • Hm. Maybe I should point out that this is the email you get when you get nullrouted?

    69.85.86.10 has been null routed for receiving DDoS

    Would it be that hard to give me a little more information so I could figure it out?

    And also did you not notice that he told me to look in a mirror? What kind of customer service agent says that lol.

  • qpsqps Member, Host Rep
    edited March 2014

    It sounds like you are receiving a DDoS attack on a non-DDoS protected service. You have unrealistic expectations if you think any provider is going to allow you to remain online when you are DDoSed repeatedly. You also have unrealistic expectations if you think you are entitled to a refund after you have used the services (and probably caused them a significant amount of headache with the DDoS attacks).

    I would recommend looking into another provider that offers DDoS protected services.

  • Xeno43Xeno43 Member
    edited March 2014

    "whatever you are doing is attracking DDoS attacks, so look in the mirror if you want someone to be pissed at"
    "whatever you are doing is attracking DDoS attacks, so look in the mirror if you want someone to be pissed at"
    "whatever you are doing is attracking DDoS attacks, so look in the mirror if you want someone to be pissed at"
    "whatever you are doing is attracking DDoS attacks, so look in the mirror if you want someone to be pissed at"

    Please notice that I'm not here to bitch because I was null routed.

    Not to mention the huge 20% packet loss that hits every couple hours at least, sometimes every 20 minutesish. Being null routed just sent me over the edge so I complained.

  • For what it's worth, I think he sounded unprofessional. Even though his actions of null routing you were justifiable and his ToS may have already stated that no refunds would be given (I don't know for sure, I haven't read them), as someone in a customer service position he should nevertheless remain polite in his replies to you.

  • TheLinuxBugTheLinuxBug Member
    edited March 2014

    The issue here is the fault lies with you and not the provider. Just because you didn't ask someone to DDOS you, "Hey Bra you wanna have fun and DDOS muh server?", you are still responsible for the attacks when they happen against you. My guess is you have managed to piss someone off that knows about your servers address and they are attacking you. It would be reasonable to assume these attacks are what was causing your packet loss and null route is logical next step when your server is taking abuse. They can't have the whole node down because you decided to piss someone off and get DDOS against your server. You need to look into a DDOS protected service that provide protection for these types of issue so that you do not see a repeat performance of this with your next provider. No low end provider is going to put up with DDOS for your $3-$8/month your paying, period*.

    Edit: * unless you are paying them for a DDOS protected ip

    I think they acted as any responsible host would. Now, he could have been a bit more polite, but one thing can be said for sure, he got the point across to you, didn't he?

    Cheers!

  • @qps and some others, why do you just look from the providers' perspective? Is it always the client's fault to receive a DDoS? The guy runs a TS server for 5 people, why would he attract "enemies"? What Tim says is like telling someone who got raped that they deserve it because their clothes are too promiscuous. And acording to @Xeno43 in this case the clothes were sunday church tier.

    Thanked by 2Floris Pwner
  • TheLinuxBugTheLinuxBug Member
    edited March 2014

    @kerouac I am not 100% certain of this, but usual provider policy says you get nulled routed for 24 hours when you receive an attack and usually it is lifted after that 24 hours and your server is returned back online, unless this is a repeat offense. By the ticket above, it sounds like instead of being understanding why his server was null routed and offline (to make it so all the other clients on the same node were not effected by his DDOS) he decided to complain that they had null routed him and chastise support about disabling his server. In most cases when you become confrontational because you don't like the answer you get, the person on the other side becomes just as annoyed that you are not willing to be understanding of the issue. In this case it sounds like the tech in question got a bit aggravated and decided to not hold his tongue when replying. May not be the most professional way to have handled it, but it is what it is.

    The fact is, it sounds like the OP is pissed off they nulled him and will not immediately lift the ban because he says so, so has decided to say that the host is bad and no one should use them because he can't have his way.

    At no point in the above exchange did the host say he was no longer welcome there. The OP was the one that said he was going to take his services elsewhere because he thought they should be responsible to handle his DDOS attacks for him, which is completely unrealistic on the face of it.

    Anyways, I suggest the OP takes a breather, thinks about the situation and decides to apologize to the host and hopefully when the null route is lifted he can use the rest of his service for the month. I will say that the OP should look into a DDOS protected service as it seems like he is able to attract such attacks and no low end provider is going to tank a DDOS for you unless you are paying for a DDOS protected service.

    Cheers!

    Thanked by 1Ian_
  • @TheLinuxBug said:
    Anyways, I suggest the OP takes a breather, thinks about the situation and decides to apologize to the host

    Eh, what?

    Thanked by 3Mark_R kerouac Pwner
  • Xeno43Xeno43 Member
    edited March 2014

    I think I was justifiably mad. I got accused of getting ddosed, again. I have been dealing with huge packet loss on the server for the last couple of months, making it almost unusable as a teamspeak server, which I was paying for. So when I got another null route, I emailed them pissed off, and I felt that email is quite professional for someone who is pissed about there server. I then get a response back telling me to look in the mirror if I want someone to be pissed at, which I think is unprofessional.

    I'm taking my services elsewhere mostly due to the packet loss. Getting told I was getting ddosed for the second time with literally nothing but their word to back it up (somewhere, there has to be logs of hundreds of IPs sending junk requests. Can't I see even a tiny part of those?), when I run a server that less then a dozen people no the address of, kind of sent me over the edge. Plus his response basically assured he will never see business from me again.

    @skagerrak said:
    Eh, what?

    Yea I was confused as well. I felt like I handled that email pretty well as a customer who has been having issues and got nullrouted for the second time for a 'ddos' on a server that hardly anyone knows about. If anything that guy should have apologized. I don't really expect him to now though, I've had a couple more emails exchanged with him at this point (once I realized I only had 4 months left anyways).

  • You should expect to get null routed if no type of ddos protection is guaranteed. He probably could of answered you in a more professional way, but you should consider yourself lucky he lifts the null route and continues to provide you service. I've had a few providers here terminate my account and steal my money on the first ddos received, while others have done the same but given a refund. Do yourself a favor and read the TOS before you buy a server, so you know what to expect.

  • qpsqps Member, Host Rep
    edited March 2014

    kerouac said: @qps and some others, why do you just look from the providers' perspective? Is it always the client's fault to receive a DDoS? The guy runs a TS server for 5 people, why would he attract "enemies"?

    Because I've seen just about every scenario. DDoS attacks don't just happen for no reason. DDoS attacks are usually launched because one person pissed off another. With Teamspeak servers, it's generally someone got banned and wants to retaliate. It's incumbent upon the server owner to better screen their users. Or, if you want to let anyone in, be prepared for the consequences when you ban someone or piss someone off.

  • Xeno43Xeno43 Member
    edited March 2014

    @grillmaster said:
    You should expect to get null routed if no type of ddos protection is guaranteed. He probably could of answered you in a more professional way, but you should consider yourself lucky he lifts the null route and continues to provide you service. I've had a few providers here terminate my account and steal my money on the first ddos received, while others have done the same but given a refund. Do yourself a favor and read the TOS before you buy a server, so you know what to expect.

    Do you know a cheap VPS company with a real TOS? I'm pretty sure they all basically say they cancel you at any time for any reason without giving you your money back. I usually just rely on the fact if its within ~90 days I'll just dispute it.

    @qps said:
    Generally, yes. DDoS attacks are usually launched because one person pissed off another. With Teamspeak servers, it's generally someone got banned and wants to retaliate. It's incumbent upon the server owner to better screen their users. Or, if you want to let anyone in, be prepared for the consequences when you ban someone or piss someone off.

    I can take a picture of my ban list. There are zero bans. There is no password. I'm not kidding when I say less than a dozen people know this domain name.

    We all moved to another server a couple months ago anyways due to the huge packet loss on this one. I was just too lazy too move my teamspeak server. There might be 3 people online at the most the last couple months. That's why I'm skeptical I was actually ddosed.

  • said: have been using it for a teamspeak server

    From some threads in LET, I learn that teamspeak packet/traffic sometimes can be quite high, and for some provider it's detected as a DDoS, and nullrouted automatically.

    So, maybe before someone running a teamspeak in a vps, they should install munin or monitoring tools that can monitor the traffic, so the user can know the incoming/outgoing packets, and also having a proof for the provider.

  • Ian_Ian_ Member
    edited March 2014

    So you get repeatedly DDOS ed and wondering why ur experiencing packet loss because someone is mad at you or you made someone mad. Actually you should of been terminated along time for repeat offenses. Plus the fact your not being truthful just makes me cast doubts.

  • FrankZFrankZ Veteran

    OP, did you asked for a new IP?

    I have a Hostigation KVM in LA and have always found Tim's customer service to be fast and professional. I personally have not experienced any packet loss over the last few months that did not also affect my VPSes from other providers in the same data center.

  • @Xeno43 this was not some personal vendetta, I was simply notifying you of my actions and giving myself a record so I could go back after 24 hours and remove the null route. As others have said, you took it too personally, as I said as well. I was simply protecting the network for the other paying customers, and I still plan to remove your null route tomorrow after 24 hours have passed. You can talk all the shit about me you care to, doesn't seem to be generating much support in your favor.

    If you have higher expectations for your $1.66/mo of service, I'm sorry, but it is unrealistic. Maybe you should up your budget a bit and visit @Francisco at BuyVM for a DDoS protected IP, but for the many who will take a little pain now and then, the service I offer is enough to meet their needs.

  • ^ this

  • IshaqIshaq Member
    edited March 2014

    My Hostigation box is rock solid. Tomorrow is it's 1 year uptime. If I hadn't rebooted or reinstalled since I purchased it would have had over 1000 days of uptime.

    root@hostigation:~# uptime

    22:03:07 up 364 days, 7:22, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

    root@hostigation:~#

    I would recommend Tim's service any day.

  • IshaqIshaq Member

    On topic, it's quite obvious any host would nullroute you for incoming DDoS. It's to protect the network.

  • matthewvzmatthewvz Member, Host Rep

    Yet another happy customer of hostigation, hasn't gone down once since I've had it.

    root@vzserver1:~# uptime
     17:10:11 up 103 days,  3:43,  1 user,  load average: 0.17, 0.04, 0.01
    
  • Xeno43Xeno43 Member
    edited March 2014

    I had good experiences for a year. Shit hit the fan during the second. I understand that other people have good experiences with them, that's just how things work.

    @miTgiB said:
    Xeno43 this was not some personal vendetta, I was simply notifying you of my actions and giving myself a record so I could go back after 24 hours and remove the null route. As others have said, you took it too personally, as I said as well. I was simply protecting the network for the other paying customers, and I still plan to remove your null route tomorrow after 24 hours have passed. You can talk all the shit about me you care to, doesn't seem to be generating much support in your favor.

    If you have higher expectations for your $1.66/mo of service, I'm sorry, but it is unrealistic. Maybe you should up your budget a bit and visit Francisco at BuyVM for a DDoS protected IP, but for the many who will take a little pain now and then, the service I offer is enough to meet their needs.

    I'm a little embarrassed that you actually run your own business lol. You tell a customer look in the mirror if you want someone to be pissed at. If you weren't so narrow-minded, you would realize I had other complaints about your service, like the ridiculous 20% packet loss. However, and I guess lucky for you, people on this forum read my post as "pissed because he got null routed for ddos," and ignore the fact that you both told me to go look in a mirror and that your service managed to give me 20% packet loss.

    Like I said in my email to you though, I wouldn't have asked for a refund if I realized I had paid in July. Who gives a shit about $8? I'll just move to a more reliable host that doesn't have 20% packet loss.

    Anyways, such is life. If you treat all your customers this way you will get whats coming to you eventually. If its just me, whatever. Life moves on.

    EDIT: Someone seems to think the packet loss is due to ddos. I do believe I said this only happens every hour or so. Some kind of strange round robin ddos? Lol

  • $8/year vps?

    Did I missed the offer? What does it comes with? Maybe I need to watch any hostigation offer now :)

  • FrankZFrankZ Veteran

    $1.66/mo of service

    x12 = $20 a year

    Thanked by 1ErawanArifNugroho
  • BradBrad Member

    Seriously, people these days have way too high expectations for a LowEnd VPS.

    Thanked by 1Amfy
  • I think the issue OP wanted to raise is that the language in the response is not professional.

  • FrankZFrankZ Veteran

    Imagine there's no countries

    It isn't hard to do

    Nothing to kill or die for

    And no religion too

    Imagine all the people living life in peace

    You, you may say

    I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one

    I hope some day you'll join us

    And the world will be as one

  • @jcaleb said:
    I think the issue OP wanted to raise is that the language in the response is not professional.

    And I fully agree with that. I don't care if the support employee is angry. Words like 'getting pissed' just are inappropriate. But I think the OP could have make a different comment instead of accusing Tim of bad service. So I think both are faulty.

  • Brad said: Seriously, people these days have way too high expectations for a LowEnd VPS.

    So we should expect crappy service from all low priced vps?

  • @TheLinuxBug said:
    Anyways, I suggest the OP takes a breather, thinks about the situation and decides to apologize to the host ...

    OP never said anything that requires him to "take a breather", he obviously cannot get a good service as he expects, and nobody has to know what a DDoS or what getting nullrouted means in order go get a service they've paid for. Apparently, they keep nullrouting the guy and don't say anything to him. They should investigate the matter. A private teamspeak server with 5 users has no affinity to attract DDoS, so why wouldn't Hostigation offer a change of IPs? Why won't Hostigation look into the IPs that DDoS and alert the authorities? We can see that the user thinks he has nothing that would attract a DDoS, so why assume he is at fault? What if someone is pissed at Hostigation and happens to DDoS a random IP on their range?

    IT IS CLEAR, that the "support" reply is the one that escalates the situation! The client gets no service, for whatever reason, and says he's sick of it, he'll move away, and wants a refund, THAT IS NORMAL! And support reply basically says F U to their CLIENT!

    After two DDoS and subsequent nullrouting, maybe contact the client and talk their options huh Hostigation? Offer a change of IPs, or fill them in on the situation and advise them to move on to a DDoS protected service!

    These guys -for some reason- just think that some client that can't get proper service because he gets nullrouted would stay with them even though it happens again! Why not just TALK! The lack of communication looks so stupid in this case. Hadn't the client opened this ticket, what was gonna happen? Hostigation would never warn him, and he'd have a VPS that's down a half the time? Is that the service they wanna sell? If you can't serve them properly, nicely ask the client to move away as their load or attractiveness of DDoSs cannot be handled by you. Don't act like they want to stay despite!!!!

Sign In or Register to comment.