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ELI5: what is causing the transistor shortage?
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ELI5: what is causing the transistor shortage?

SirFoxySirFoxy Member
edited May 2021 in General

rather than asking on reddit i figured i'd ask here since some of y'all are fucking nerds

what is causing the transistor shortage?

why is the supply chain of things such as the switch, ps5, and xbox series x so poor?

Thanked by 2JustPfff BlaZe
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Comments

  • China

  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member

    @dahartigan said:
    China

    Australia

    Thanked by 1bdl
  • @SirFoxy said:

    @dahartigan said:
    China

    Australia

    Canada

  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member

    @dahartigan said:

    @SirFoxy said:

    @dahartigan said:
    China

    Australia

    Canada

    United States

  • @SirFoxy said:

    @dahartigan said:

    @SirFoxy said:

    @dahartigan said:
    China

    Australia

    Canada

    United States

    China

  • WilliamWilliam Member
    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage
  • Daddy Elon is secretly smuggling all semi conductors to his mars colony

    Thanked by 1logaritse
  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member

    @dahartigan said:

    @SirFoxy said:

    @dahartigan said:

    @SirFoxy said:

    @dahartigan said:
    China

    Australia

    Canada

    United States

    China

    Kazakhstan

    Thanked by 1dahartigan
  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member

    @William said:

    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage

    so it isn't supply overweighing demand?

    it'll fix itself eventually without a requirement for better innovation?

  • FranciscoFrancisco Top Host, Host Rep, Veteran

    @William said:

    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage

    You missed a crypto boom as well.

    Video cards are on average 2x MSRP on anything under a 3090.

    Francisco

    Thanked by 2lentro MannDude
  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited May 2021

    Yes, also the water limitations in Taiwan are no issue YET, they will affect wafers only on 3-6 months. So things will still get worse.

    There is also no simple solution - Taiwan has PLENTY nuclear power for desalination plants, but try to build that in half a year... impossible. Same for shipping water - sounds easy right? But get contracts with another country, and suitable (CLEAN!) tankers and ships to put them on etc. - The supply chain is complex.

    Money is not the issue for once, TSMC (or even the Taiwan gov) would gladly pay whatever needed to get this sorted, it's simply not possible right now.

    Then you have Infineon and others in Europe that could produce transistors/diodes/older process nodes (45nm-120um) but don't have the supply capacity for the needed materials... and then it goes in circles again. Same for Vishay and others in India. You can't just ramp up production x10, after COVID you can be happy to even get to x1 again fast.

    Some countries are even lacking people to EMPLOY by this scaling problems, like Czechia, with nearly 100% of the population being employed even with COVID (unemployment rate 1.95%, down from 3% in 2018, and this 2% are basically people that are near retirement age and canÄt work anymore...)

    It's a crazy world right now in that sector.

    Buy TSMC, Samsung and AMD stonks btw., can't loose anything there. Zero possibility.

    Thanked by 2Aluminat lentro
  • GanonkGanonk Member

    @dahartigan said:

    China

    welcome back, Sir.

    how are you ;)

    Thanked by 1dahartigan
  • @Ganonk said:

    @dahartigan said:

    China

    welcome back, Sir.

    how are you ;)

    Thank you sir! Good to be back :-)

    Thanked by 1Ganonk
  • GanonkGanonk Member

    i'm glad to hear it <3

    Thanked by 1dahartigan
  • YmpkerYmpker Member

    @dahartigan said:

    @Ganonk said:

    @dahartigan said:

    China

    welcome back, Sir.

    how are you ;)

    Thank you sir! Good to be back :-)

    Welcome back, mate! Good to see you :)

    Thanked by 1dahartigan
  • jsgjsg Member, Resident Benchmarker
    edited May 2021

    What @William said plus a just-in-time attitude throughout virtually the whole sector plus wars, wars as in silent not or not yet military wars, economic wars, war preparations as well as very major countries being profoundly pi__ed off by the USA (sanctions, smearing, threats, etc.) and its "allies" (actually more like vasalls).

    (Oh, and: welcome back @dahartigan )

    Thanked by 2SirFoxy dahartigan
  • WilliamWilliam Member

    Yes, the economic wars are very real.

    I saw that coming years ago already when Israel started to bring up FABs with gov money.

    You don't invest 75billion+ dollars if you have no reason to, and our military has no need for cutting edge FABs (in fact, most military equipment is still at 100um+, because in military applications aside of space exploration/rocketry power and space usage is practically irrelevant).

    The average F16E/F runs on 10-15 year old hardware, only the communications link is top notch, everything else is done by a supercomputer at base.

  • FranciscoFrancisco Top Host, Host Rep, Veteran

    @William said:

    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage

    You missed a crypto boom as well.

    Video cards are on average 2x MSRP on anything under a 3090.

    Francisco

    @William said: Yes, also the water limitations in Taiwan are no issue YET, they will affect wafers only on 3-6 months. So things will still get worse.

    There is also no simple solution - Taiwan has PLENTY nuclear power for desalination plants, but try to build that in half a year... impossible. Same for shipping water - sounds easy right? But get contracts with another country, and suitable (CLEAN!) tankers and ships to put them on etc. - The supply chain is complex.

    Yeah I've been keeping a close eye on the water talks to see if the can get through it or if its inevitable that there'll be shutdowns over it.

    I'm trying to source enough cpu's to last us through our goals for this year but it's getting tough.

    Francisco

  • Growing TERF activity is pushing the trans-sisters into hiding.

    Thanked by 1kalipus
  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Veteran

    @William said: most military equipment is still at 100um+

    Isn't that because it's easier to emp-protect stuff in that range?

  • @SirFoxy said:

    @William said:

    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage

    so it isn't supply overweighing demand?

    Wtf? There's a shortage and you're confirming the cause isn't too much available?

  • JustPfffJustPfff Member
    edited May 2021

    @SirFoxy said: since some of y'all are fucking nerds

    Long story short Sony and M$ released their next gen consoles on the same days, and these consoles designed by AMD and manufactured at TMSC (Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company),on the same 7nm silicone, and to make things worst AMD release it new flagship CPU/GPU's on the same freaking period of time,
    and what makes things worst for couple months before these products manufactured, Apple/(I guess Huawei too) toke big share of the 7nm node capacity from TMSC(last year), which made AMD waiting in the queue couple months before Apple moved to next 5nm chips node,
    AMD new product demands were way more than what they expect it, it was normal to have GPU shortage at launch, but CPU shortage were weird one.
    And what's made thing worst Cryptocurrency, even everyone denied it, but big numbers if these new GPU went directly from the OEM manufactures to Cryptocurrency dealers.
    last COVID-19, having all these manufacturers not working on all it human resources power make them lower the productions.

    According to some estimations Chip makers are behind the market demand by 30% which will make this crisis to continue for couple years from now (until new manufactures opens )

    Thanked by 1SirFoxy
  • raindog308raindog308 Administrator, Veteran
    edited May 2021

    @SirFoxy said: transistor shortage

    Shortage of transylvanian sisters?

    @cociu

    Thanked by 2SirFoxy dahartigan
  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member
    edited May 2021

    @TimboJones said:

    @SirFoxy said:

    @William said:

    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage

    so it isn't supply overweighing demand?

    Wtf? There's a shortage and you're confirming the cause isn't too much available?

    the point was is it circumstantial or a flaw in production capabilities as a whole

  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member

    @raindog308 said:

    @SirFoxy said: transistor shortage

    Shortage of transylvanian sisters?

    @cociu

    never that

    Thanked by 1isunbejo
  • MannDudeMannDude Host Rep, Veteran

    Its also impacting the automotive manufacturing industry aswell. I have a day job currently in a machine shop that makes parts for Honda. Chip shortages has caused production issues since some of the parts gets chipped down the line for sensors and other modern automotive computing.

  • @SirFoxy said:

    @TimboJones said:

    @SirFoxy said:

    @William said:

    • COVID-19 causing supply shortage of rare earth metals from China and Africa
    • Limited transport capacity since COVID-19 removed a lot of shipping capacity both air and sea
    • A water shortage in Taiwan
    • Tsunamis in Indonesia and the Phillipines
    • A huge power outage in Western China due to a mine collapse causing a coal shortage

    so it isn't supply overweighing demand?

    Wtf? There's a shortage and you're confirming the cause isn't too much available?

    the point was is it circumstantial or a flaw in production capabilities as a whole

    Now you're speaking french. No comprende. Making less sense than before.

  • WilliamWilliam Member

    @TimboJones said: Now you're speaking french. No comprende. Making less sense than before.

    Its actually a perfectly valid sentence in english.

    And the answer is circumstantial, mostly by covid and related. The production capacity is the same, but covid caused shortages in the chain AND sold more devices globally.

    Thanked by 1SirFoxy
  • SirFoxySirFoxy Member
    edited May 2021

    @William said:

    @TimboJones said: Now you're speaking french. No comprende. Making less sense than before.

    Its actually a perfectly valid sentence in english.

    And the answer is circumstantial, mostly by covid and related. The production capacity is the same, but covid caused shortages in the chain AND sold more devices globally.

    see my boi William understands, Timbo.

  • randomqrandomq Member

    I heard it was from all the microchips Bill Gates put in the vaccines... /s

    Seriously though I hear Samsung and AMD are coming out with a new chip to take on the M1. Where are they going to manufacture that?

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