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The last time I saw the thread before it was hidden were my comments. I didn't know the nature it turned into, but at the same time, you guys have let a lot worse go on, and even when things get really messy - the threads were closed as most.
It didn't deserved to be deleted. The guy left his IP and domain name in the shots, along with his ASN. Clearly wasn't a scammer or using a fake name, etc. His freaking username was his initials.
The other OP seemed to be more pissed about the bait and switch aspect, and wanted to warn anyone about the time and effort he wasted setting up a hosting account with them, with the sole intention of expanding his Anycast account with them
Okay, after reviewing the facts and seeing the thread, I wouldn't go as far to say corruption. Maybe the correct word would be more along the lines of nepotism... too strong - maybe just bias? Some current and past admins here either are friends with Incero / their staff, have servers from Incero, or have even worked in some way for them.
You pair that with someone who is a moderator passing info that Incero and SpeedyKVM aren't related, and then finally when I went to find the updates, the thread was gone. I woke up a little pissed and over-reacted with some of my verbiage, sorry about that @willie.
Still didn't pass the smell test, and deserved an explanation. Not the administrator going all 'calm yourself' me and @default because your actions deviated from standard operating procedure in almost every case.
I figured it was swept under the rug. Why did I spell it out? I didn't appreciate the immediate 'OMG calm yourself, tinfoil!' when I questioned the actions of why it was deleted. In fact, my first thread didn't name the other moderator.
Then another 'moderator' piles on with semantics "ohh, looks he's giving himself the ability to be wrong"
Why? Because I used "Looks like"... really? That's why I spelled out exactly what I thought was going on with more colorful language.
Not sure what's going on @jsg but I'm not aag? If you've worked with Anycast or setup VMs in multiple locations for paying Anycast customers, as I did for years, you could very easily fill in the few missing tickets with every possibility that happened.
He started the first sentence of his introduction to Incero wanting Anycast. Anycast is primarily used to give low-latency to locations around the world. It's use is pretty damn obvious. You engineer a network to route to the nearest server from your geographic location. Usually for distributing files, serving DNS, etc. He even explained he was expanding his footprint and gave his ASN.
As for the moderators who suggested "derp, give him admin access, see what a bore this place is!" - I think you didn't understand the point of what I was suggesting.
I don't think you guys meet up together in a secret Slack or Discord, or are secretive like masons.. or are organized at all. That part's clear. It just seemed to be a bit of good 'ol favoritism, and I wanted a clarification.
One part is true @willie was right - I wanted to see what happened in the thread, if that was done instead of Anthony responding to a rational question, this thread wouldn't have been so damn long. Once opened, it was a lot milder than expected, and I don't believe should've have been deleted (from the URL index & view) or "hidden" as you call it in the first place. If a user that's logged in can't see it, I'd call that 'deleted' - As most, it should have been hidden from non-logged in users due to lack of requested evidence and closed.
I personally think the guy couldn't be bothered to spend more time posting his entire ticket history and posted enough of the relevant stuff. But perhaps he's not real, the ASN is fake, as well as his domain and business. Honestly, I don't know many situations that could go on in between buying 3 VMs and requesting BGP setup except for SpeedyKVM's lack of management and communication when it came time to set up the actual session.
@Kris
As I already said I tend to believe @aag's story but LET has certain rules and those rules are not unreasonable.
The facts seem to be pretty clear: aag is lacking in terms of evidence and that's not Incero's fault but his own as he had his account deleted and the relevant communication with it. I can understand that from a human/emotional point of view but in the end that was HIS decision/action - not Incero's and not LET's or @willie's.
Similarly I don't see any basis for accusations against the mods here. What were their options considering that there are clear, reasonable, and well known rules that demand for credible and conclusive evidence when accusing a provider?
Maybe the way some mods handled it wasn't the most elegant and smart but it was neither oppressive nor dirty but within the frame of the rules and certainly not justifying what was thrown at them.
I don't know if this aligns with the thinking of @Kris, but there exists in every community of this type a double standard among the members on the importance of and the degree to which evidence is required. Most commonly, from my experience, it falls into these two categories:
Opinions are largely in favor of this provider, accusation is shocking and paints a dear friend in a negative way, more evidence is required.
Opinions are largely not in favor of this provider, accusation is not shocking and paints a picture that matches the viewpoint most members have toward the provider, less evidence is required. Only a shill would ask for the same consideration as #1.
I saw this on WHT constantly, and it's no surprise that one can see it here in many places if one chooses to look. It's natural behavior. At WHT I saw it plainly: Long time members who were friends with everyone were allowed to make any wild accusation about EIG without ever proving they were ever a customer. New members could not post a review of a provider that was not part of the boys club without excessive evidence of them being a customer. Complaints about the double standard were ignored.
The double standard will always exist, of course. If someone comes in here and says Clouvider told them to kill themselves, it's going to be reported by 6 members within the hour. If someone said it about Delimiter, it'll be there for a year because the host isn't here to defend themselves and no member is going to report it. Because we all have opinions formed about some providers, and anything that matches our opinion of what they might do is given more of a leash.
All that said, the mods here try not to be this way and I think they do a good job of it, but if you're fair and treat #2 like #1, you're going to be called out for it by members who do not try to avoid that mentality. They will call you corrupt or a shill.
@jarland hit the nail on the head.
It's hard not to form some amount of bias, even subconsciously when you've worked with the provider, have plans with the provider, or actively work for them and know them more than the normal member does.
If anything you'll need to go out of your way to avoid it, act impartial. Like @AnthonySmith said, he reviewed the thread and after doing it, came up with the opinion that it shouldn't have been hidden. I like that type of honesty.
Most of all, Jarland, you have good reason to run to their aid, but have remained incredibly neutral. In this case coherently explaining what I am struggling to.
If someone came in here and said QuadIX was now run out of a basement on bonded FIOS connections, we'd all start guessing where. If someone said the same about Cloudiver, Incero, or anyone else... they would be read the riot act.
I guess I wanted to call it out, and see if there was proper merit for deleting it from view, and when met with hostility... came back with some.
@jarland
We miss you, Jar. That was spot on.
Group hug?
LET is the way it is, the fact is the majority of the regulars, that is regular posters, don’t really want it to change. The mix of deals, drama and occasional but useful technical discussion fits the average member appetite. Time and time again people claim the toxic nature of the forum means the segment is missing a better option. The most recent attempt being hostballs which appears to have died as expected for the same reason all other attempts have.
LET won't change anytime soon.
I of course agree. You confirm, repeat, and (in a smart and insightful way) elaborate on what I had already said:
That's a given and a grown up user doesn't expect perfect unbiasedness. And still the rules are the rules both for the users and for the admins and mods.
My point was whether the admins and mods here really acted grossly biased, biased enough to throw mud like "corrupted" at them. I don't see a basis for that. I see mods who acted within the frame of the rules and whithin the level of unbiasedness that can be reasonably expected from a human being.
Finally I hinted at a very relevant fact: It was (a consequence of) @aag's own decision to have his account deleted before at least screenshotting the conversation. So how would that suddenly turn against the mods here who merely asked what they always ask and what the rules tell them to ask for?
I personally still believe @aag's story. But I also still fail to see mods acting in evil "corrupt" ways in this case. And I still think that the problem in this case is with @aag who (even if understandably from a human view) blew up the house before shooting some evidence photos in it and now is short on evidence.
This feels and sounds like debating politics because -
Damn, this reminds me of the White house.
That's because the end is nigh!
>
idk, from what i read ant agreed that maybe hiding the thread wasnt the right move, so maybe next time he reconsiders the actions.
but yeah, went unnecessarily long, i guess mainly due to strong language by op (calling corruption and all)
I asked, repeatedly, what more you want for "proof" given the facts as stated -- I asked them to delete my account immediately. They did. All I have are emails. The one I screenshot is the only email relevant. You want a paypal receipt?
The real question is what, precisely, could I have done to have my services pre-emptively terminated and get a "do you want $1000/month CDN services or a refund?"
because that's what happened. I ask again -- clearly and pointedly -- what precisely is the burden you expect me to reach in order to "prove" there is no other side to the story that is being omitted.
you can't answer me that. and instead the thread gets deleted.
https://speedykvm.com/billing/viewticket.php?tid=269487&c=Uts5S2gK
You provided that, it is still active, your account was not deleted, provide the link to the other ticket you just added the partial screenshot for. (its in your emails)
That time never came. I opened a ticket to get the BGP sessions configured, and some hours later everything was terminated while I was on them.
there are no missing tickets. I don't do a CDN -- at all. Hell I don't even have DNS going as of yet. I've indulged myself in turning up tens of more sites. Mostly out of anger over this SpeedyKVM bullshit. And also because the dfz views are of some value to me immediately.
Yup. I received my refund. As I will say until I'm blue in the face -- it's a bait & switch. I'm only out my time.
AFAICT AnyNode is somehow related and/or a customer of Incero? Would like to know if I'm wrong but I looked at them and found some relationship (that I can't recall at this moment) and immediately dropped them from consideration.
thank you. the ASN is very real (see whois) and my business is in IP networking -- not hosting. I started out in hosting many many years ago and am all too experienced with sleezeballs and idiots who somehow make a living with trash business ethics and policies.
I had the ACCOUNT deleted because I dont want to have ANY relationship with a business that runs SCAMS on customers. The only spin here is the two marbles in your head.
I don't need a 4chan army. This place is ostensibly to leave reviews of hosts. I was leaving a review of the SCAM I encountered with SpeedyKVM. Instead of letting it be, you desire an arbitrary, ill-defined, and frankly impossible to meet standard of "proof".
politely go fuck yourself, willie.
Man, people nowadays are good at digging their own graves.
Common sense 101 and level 1 perception go a long way.
Anyone need to know why he was banned? i hope it is obvious if not take yourself over here: https://www.lowendtalk.com/discussion/137719/lowendtalk-community-rules/p1
Its not. Is it because of:
Damn how many times did he have to scream scam? We got the point he thinks it was bait and switch.
I'm still lukewarm on agreeing to even that. Too many unknowns and all of the scam screaming makes me wonder.
I think @aag has a VR headset on 24 7.
Do you not? I have Slack on the wall of my VR house.
Mine's Lowend VR which all it does is display "The end is nigh" in glowing red text.
I personally don't think SpeedyKVM are scammers (that involves deliberate deception). I do think they are psycho and I'd generally advise staying away from them. Anyone who thinks SpeedyKVM is receiving favoritism from Anthony or me needs to check out SpeedyKVM's history here (hint: if you look at their profile page https://www.lowendtalk.com/profile/speedykvm the "banned" graphic on it might jump out at you). That said, some LET regulars who used SpeedyKVM before they banned new signups from LET members have had good experiences and maybe still do, which is great for those members. I prefer an insanity-free hosting experience myself but that's just me.
So what happened with aag? I dunno, I'd have to see aag's ticket. I'm unimpressed by aag's quibbling about deleting the ticket vs deleting the account so he can't post the ticket. One thing I do know is that it contained the words "fuck yourself", "scam", "bait and switch" etc. some number of times (maybe zero) or maybe other forms of abuse (or maybe not), etc. Unlike @Kris, I'm not willing to make presumptions or accept aag's self-serving claims about this: I need to see the damn ticket in order to know.
I apologize profusely to aag that LET staff had aag's SpeedyKVM account deleted so that aag can't document what happened. It's all our fault that we got in the way of his crusade. We should never have (just a sec, phone's ringing)... what's that? LET didn't get the account deleted? Aag did it his own self? Oh whoops then, correction: It's aag's own fault, not LET's, that the account is deleted and he can't document what happened. No sympathy then. The rule for these situations is docs or GTFO, so if you yourself had the docs deleted, that leaves GTFO. Or if anyone remembers Emily Litella: "never mind!".
Anyway, LET is a discussion forum, not an SEO service. Someone worked up about a post not being indexed is already trying to use the site for something other than its intended purpose. And even a solidly documented case doesn't give a poster carte blanche for keyword stuffing if we do leave the post indexed. Vengeance-as-a-service (VaaS) is not a feature that we offer (also called NYPA). Stay with factual reports and document everything and you'll look less like an axe-grinding psycho yourself.
And... the "Top Drama Story" LET award of 2018 goes to: this thread!