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Is this what getting old feels like?

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Comments

  • eva2000eva2000 Veteran
    edited September 1

    @LEBUserJoe said: Having DeepSeek V4 talk to Kimi, GLM, Minimax, Claude or GPT is an insult.

    Waste of credits, and reasoning this is beyond overkill and will lead to even worse results.

    In a multi-AI consult, even DeepSeek V4 brings unique findings to the table from my experience picking up issues even SOTA models didn't (confirmed by SOTA models). My multi-AI consults on average surface 50% to 200% more findings than standalone Claude Fable 5 or GPT-5.6 Sold can find!

    I mainly use the multi-AI consults at planning or post-implementation verification phase so relatively they don't use as much tokens but ensure you start with an accurate plan to begin with = saving you tokens and time - preventing you from going down the wrong path.

  • @eva2000 said:

    @LEBUserJoe said: Having DeepSeek V4 talk to Kimi, GLM, Minimax, Claude or GPT is an insult.

    Waste of credits, and reasoning this is beyond overkill and will lead to even worse results.

    In a multi-AI consult, even DeepSeek V4 brings unique findings to the table from my experience picking up issues even SOTA models didn't (confirmed by SOTA models). My multi-AI consults on average surface 50% to 200% more findings than standalone Claude Fable 5 or GPT-5.6 Sold can find!

    Yes but reasoning is expentional the more models, 3 is intensive, 4 is very intensive, 8+ is stupid, or they aren't all reasoning with each-other and it's selective which is just as random as not having that many.

    "Unique Findings" no was just that particular prompts which founds some of that particular billions of parameters at that time, all other models capable.

    I assure you this is a waste of reasoning and LLM compute, it's beyond useless to have more than 4 models consult.

    **4 models create 6 pairwise relationships; 8 create 28. **

    Simply put, if it doesn't over-comptue that they aren't all reasoning with eachother anyways.

  • @LEBUserJoe said:
    I assure you this is a waste of reasoning and LLM compute, it's beyond useless to have more than 4 models consult.

    **4 models create 6 pairwise relationships; 8 create 28. **

    Simply put, if it doesn't over-comptue that they aren't all reasoning with eachother anyways.

    Well I don't use all the LLM models all the time, I said up to 8 LLM models supported. I usually only use 2-4 of them, Claude, GPT-5.6 Sol, GLM-5.3 are the main 3 right now.

  • rpqurpqu Member

    I recall @layer7 has one of the best practice when responding to ticket
    Too bad image that @sillycat post already expired

  • SplitIceSplitIce Member, Host Rep
    edited September 1

    @ralf said: None of that has anything to do with getting old

    I think part of the “getting old” feeling is noticing other people behaving in ways you wouldn’t have considered acceptable yourself.

    And I swear it’s not just me becoming a grumpy old man, staring at a wall of AI-generated text and muttering that the young whippersnappers should go back to actually debugging things (yet)

  • zedzed Veteran

    @SplitIce said: And I swear it’s not just me becoming a grumpy old man, staring at a wall of AI-generated text and muttering that the young whippersnappers should go back to actually debugging things (yet)

    how do you feel about unboxing videos?

  • layer7layer7 Member, Host Rep, LIR
    edited September 1

    @rpqu said:
    I recall @layer7 has one of the best practice when responding to ticket

    Hi,

    the general practice with any kind of non technical what ever bla bla blob ( no matter if its coming from the internet / forum / blog or AI ) is that the longer the text is, the less brain activity will be done and more and more frequently whole lines of bla bla will just be skipped by my eyes and the brain will filter more and more the rest.

    When i reached the buttom of this and did not understand it, i ask for clarification and more technical details :-)

    EDIT:

    But to contribute something more real here:

    @SplitIce yes. The future is agents handling things. If they cant, the senior level agent handles ( Token will be more expensive ). And that goes up until some human will read it.... maybe :D

    Thanked by 2eva2000 rpqu
  • @forest said:
    You wanna know what being old really feels like?

    It's the realization that we're closer to the year 2050 than we are to the year 2000.

    I probably would have gone another 10-15 years in ignorant bliss if it wasn't for this!

  • If I worked in support, I'd be the guy reminding people they need some admin skills and to get managed services instead.

  • SaragoldfarbSaragoldfarb Veteran, Megathread Squad

    At least people haven't started calling you "granny" yet :D

  • rpqurpqu Member

    @Saragoldfarb said:
    At least people haven't started calling you "granny" yet :D

    Huh? Is your daughter already pregnant or something? Or your nephews kid?

  • @rpqu said:

    @Saragoldfarb said:
    At least people haven't started calling you "granny" yet :D

    Huh? Is your daughter already pregnant or something? Or your nephews kid?

    She's only got one son, but he's struggling with a drug addiction.

  • rpqurpqu Member

    @forest said:

    @rpqu said:

    @Saragoldfarb said:
    At least people haven't started calling you "granny" yet :D

    Huh? Is your daughter already pregnant or something? Or your nephews kid?

    She's only got one son, but he's struggling with a drug addiction.

    Oof. There's so much drug in NL. Can't go hiking or picnic or sitting on a park bench without smelling pot.

  • ralfralf Member

    @zed said:

    @SplitIce said: And I swear it’s not just me becoming a grumpy old man, staring at a wall of AI-generated text and muttering that the young whippersnappers should go back to actually debugging things (yet)

    how do you feel about unboxing videos?

    What's being unboxed?

  • ralfralf Member

    @Saragoldfarb said:
    At least people haven't started calling you "granny" yet :D

    That reminds me of university days when one of our friends was called "Grandma $SURNAME" by almost everyone because she was a year older than everyone else.

    Thanked by 1Saragoldfarb
  • VoidVoid Member

    It's simple. You feed that ticket into your AI along with your findings and ask it to frame a response that is relevant. AI problems require AI solutions.

    Thanked by 1rpqu
  • Aluy has you click a check-box where you confirm that the message was written by a human. Presumably not selecting it lowers the priority or prompts you to turn off your clanker and try again.

  • @forest said:
    Aluy has you click a check-box where you confirm that the message was written by a human. Presumably not selecting it lowers the priority or prompts you to turn off your clanker and try again.

    I was tempted, to not check it a couple times, to see what happens 🤣

    Thanked by 1forest
  • @Mainfrezzer said:

    @forest said:
    Aluy has you click a check-box where you confirm that the message was written by a human. Presumably not selecting it lowers the priority or prompts you to turn off your clanker and try again.

    I was tempted, to not check it a couple times, to see what happens 🤣

    Oh me too. :D

  • rpqurpqu Member

    @forest said:

    @Mainfrezzer said:

    @forest said:
    Aluy has you click a check-box where you confirm that the message was written by a human. Presumably not selecting it lowers the priority or prompts you to turn off your clanker and try again.

    I was tempted, to not check it a couple times, to see what happens 🤣

    Oh me too. :D

    It's wnba player

  • @emre said:
    use the German way.

    fix the problem and the ticket answer is

    Fixed.

    or

    Done.

    I have few services that do this, always respect it, and it's always fucking fixed correctly.

  • 30 is old now .

    Thanked by 1oloke
  • SplitIceSplitIce Member, Host Rep

    @forest said:

    @Mainfrezzer said:

    @forest said:
    Aluy has you click a check-box where you confirm that the message was written by a human. Presumably not selecting it lowers the priority or prompts you to turn off your clanker and try again.

    I was tempted, to not check it a couple times, to see what happens 🤣

    Oh me too. :D

    Is it just on high priority tickets? I feel that maybe a checkbox that says "I confirm that I have done basic troubleshooting and included technical readouts" might actually be fair for high priority tickets.

    Pretty much all the notes examples of these ai generated tickets were opened as high priority (even if they were sales / capability questions)

  • rpqurpqu Member

    @Jackma1 said:
    30 is old now .

    Yes. 30 years old boomer
    image image
    imageimage
    image

  • SaragoldfarbSaragoldfarb Veteran, Megathread Squad

    @forest said:

    @rpqu said:

    @Saragoldfarb said:
    At least people haven't started calling you "granny" yet :D

    Huh? Is your daughter already pregnant or something? Or your nephews kid?

    She's only got one son, but he's struggling with a drug addiction.

    'Alledgely'

    Thanked by 2forest rpqu
  • AI slop is the worst

  • AndreixAndreix Host Rep, Veteran

    @SplitIce said:
    Has anyone else working support noticed this becoming a thing?

    It’s certainly not every ticket (probably not even 1 in 20) but it happens often enough now to be noticeable.

    You receive a support request that is clearly AI-generated: a long, very confident list of possible causes, investigations to perform, logs to collect, configuration areas to inspect, and questions that supposedly need answering.

    The problem is that there’s often almost no actual troubleshooting behind it. No test results. No packet captures. No logs showing the problem. And usually even if checked within 10 minutes of the ticket being opened unverifiable as described. Usually barely even a clear description of what actually happened and never is the matter at hand enough to support the many directions of investigation being requested.

    Instead of a support ticket, you get what amounts to an AI-generated incident investigation checklist containing ten or twenty different theories, many of which make little sense in the context of the reported problem. Properly investigating and responding to every item could take a human hours or days, despite the customer having spent perhaps thirty seconds generating the request.

    And that seems like a particularly bad direction for support. We (support representatives) being treated like an extension of the customers Agents is not sustainable or healthy.

    I want to stress I have no problem with people using AI. Its a great tool to help explain a problem, clean up a post, interpret an error message, or suggest some useful troubleshooting steps. It can even write code worthy of careful a review in many cases. Using AI can make the outcome better when used as a tool (or at-least thats what I think). P.S In the search of irony I am using AI now to help me improve my grammar in this post and used it plenty throught the day.

    But there seems to be a growing category of ticket where AI isn't being used to communicate or as a tool to assist in the resolution of the problem - it's being used instead of doing the troubleshooting (probably including opening the ticket).

    The result is a strange asymmetry: one side can generate an enormous amount of work essentially for free, while the support representative on the other end is still expected to actually read it, understand it, test it, and respond meaningfully often requiring hours or days to do so to the normally expected standard.

    Is this where SaaS and hosting support is heading?

    Do providers eventually just deploy agents to respond to the customers' agents? Then another agent handles the escalation, another handles the complaint that the first agent wasn't helpful, and another handles the retention offer when the customer threatens to leave?

    At some point we're going to have two language models arguing with each other while the actual probelem remains and the situations continues as it was in the first place.

    Maybe this is just what getting old feels like.

    Has anyone else started seeing this? And if you run support for a hosting or SaaS business, how are you dealing with it?

    Nope... old feels like saying "meeh! fuck it!" about anything anytime.
    Got to market and all regular human-op registers are empty and just self-pay registers?! You say: "Meh, fuck it!" and just leave the cart there and leave.

    Your car makes weird noise and the service is quoting you a 5h+ bill?
    "Meh! Fuck it!" - you just turn up the music and stop hearing that noise.

    You should take out the trash but you just stare at it for a while and go: "Meh! Fuck it!".

    This can be mixed up with laziness but ... meh... fuck it! Who cares?!

  • I agree, it’s not fun at all when reviewing tickets. It’s doesn’t help when many types of businesses are incentivised to use it.

    Even when clients publicly state they ignore AI responses to tickets from the vendor for example. It just continues because why not.

    The countless times I’ve read clients getting mad about slop from the vendor, only for it to continue as normal is concerning.

    The joys of being in the service business.

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