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Dutch Authorities Seize Windscribe VPN server without a warrant
"THIS IS NOT A DRILL: The Dutch authorities, without a warrant, just seized one of our VPN servers saying they'll give it back after they "fully analyze it".
Windscribe uses RAM disk servers so the only thing the authorities will find is a stock Ubuntu install. The bigger worry is the unredacted Epstein files we had on there..."
Source: https://x.com/windscribecom/status/2019529769008685438
Thanked by 1JohnnySac
Comments
"Windscribe uses RAM disk servers so the only thing the authorities will find is a stock Ubuntu install."
Genuine question; how does this work if it only contains a stock Ubuntu install? I assume it has to pull it's config from somewhere during boot and load it to a RAMdisk, right?
Usually involves a bootloader that pulls a signed os build from another box, then verifies the signature before booting. Found an older blog post from them on it here: https://windscribe.com/blog/nodeos-booting-from-ram/
after boot just a cron job which creates a ramdisk, copies all vpns software stuff to it, and start the vpn daemons from that mount.
You should have hidden the servers under your bed.
Without a warrant? Huh?
IF Windscribe can proove what the contents were (before the pull) they can check & verify and if even one single byte is missing after server is returned, they can sue the living hell out of the dutch Gestapo.
But of course that's nearly impossible with RAM-disks only.
2nd point: "without a warrant". Now, I'm absolutely no expert re dutch law but from what (little) I know, an court warrant is an unconditional MUST.
3rd point: "saying they'll give it back after they "fully analyze it". (a) any computer/smartphone, etc. that has been in the hands of fbi/police/Gestapo must be considered hacked! so the only correct response to that is "you can keep your prey, we'll send the invoice for a replacement server to you", and (b) pardon me, is the dutch Gestapo joking? What's next, maybe "sorry we need compute power, so we borrowed your server. You'll get it back once we're done"?
TL;DR It seems netherland doesn't care about proper legal procedure anymore and use Gestapo methods.
The day their Gestapo HQ are DDOSed to hell will be a beautiful day. FU dutch Gestapo!
I think it’s just a clever but pure marketing tweet to milk the maximum out of the Epstein topic that is trending.
There are situations where the Dutch police can legally seize a server without a warrant.
For example, if a crime is caught in the act, or if there is an urgent necessity due to the risk of immediate data destruction.
edit:
In EU countries, you can sue and get actual losses covered, plus a small amount of compensation, if the police have done anything wrong. It’s not like the US: we don’t have gunfights with the police over property rights, and it’s not possible to get rich from billion-dollar lawsuits.
This is a good reminder about jurisdiction shopping for privacy-focused services. RAM-disk servers are becoming more common exactly for situations like this - even if seized, the data is volatile and gone on power loss.
Interesting point from @xvps about EU vs US legal systems. In the Netherlands, the police can indeed act without a warrant in certain urgent circumstances, but there are supposed to be strict post-facto judicial oversight requirements.
The bigger question for VPN providers is always: what minimal logging is truly required for operations? Windscribe has been pretty transparent about their setup, which is more than many competitors can say.
What you’re writing is just stupid noise. You clearly have absolutely zero insight into EU/Dutch legal procedures.
What stops them from copying the data while the server is running besides bringing too few hard drives to copy to?
I would have accidentally shut it down
Guys, I have probably missed something: could you please drop a line on how epstein pedo-leak is connected to windscribe?
Or it is Putin / KGB again, who uploaded the pantless prince photos there?
I wouldn't be so sure that using a RAM disk is enough to keep data safe once someone gains physical access to the server.
The police could easily have brought some kind of portable UPS that would allow them to avoid a shutdown whilst removing the device for forensics.
There's also various mechanisms for physically dumping the contents of RAM from a running system, which is a high-end capability that law enforcement often have.
Whether they did any of that or not isn't known yet, but just assuming your secure because everything is stored in RAM, (despite the adversary gaining physical access to the system), is a bit of a cope.
So, let's wait and see what "urgent circumstances there were". My mistrusting guess: must be kept secret for some reason (like e.g. so as to not disturb a - probably not actual for quite some time - court case).
No matter what, IMO this boils down to "NL ~ law abiding safe place for hosting" being wrong now, because if some Gestapo goons can just walk in, mention something (if that at all) about "urgent circumstances" and take away a server then "proper legal proceeding and safety" are out of the window and it's just a thinly disguised Gestapo clown show.
You are such an idiot.
There are strict laws regulating this, and the owner of the servers can choose to challenge the seizure in court, where the police must prove they had the legal right to do so.
Secondly, this procedure can only be used when investigating serious crimes.
And since you are Russian: sexual abuse of children is considered a serious crime in the EU, and a state leader cannot simply cover it up or relabel it as something else, as is done in the US and Russia.
And this does not applies to Epstein clients, no matter if you are from/in EU or US! You can rape as much as you want as long as you are Epstein client!
Also, commercial VPN providers tend to conveniently forget explaining their customers that identifying a user does not require physical access to, or seizure of any VPN server.
Flow-level telemetry, collected upstream, is most of the times enough to identify the VPN customer, even in the absence of cooperation from the VPN company.
Sure, because we all know that police nevar ignores laws and rules ...
Besides: They confronted their victim (Windriver) with a fait accompli, so they should present the reason, circumstances, etc. to their victim - instead of "feel free to challenge it in court".
FYI: sexual abuse of children is considered a serious crime in Russia as well. As for state leaders ... oh well, we have seen that western state leaders can cover up their illegal actions or relabel them as something else.
Anyway, why do you carry your hatred against Russia over to here? This here is nothing to do with Russia.
So the question is: which (Dutch) datacenter even lets the police come in without a warrant? They should never be allowed inside to seize hardware without a legal warrant.
I’m not familiar with Dutch law, but there are legal mechanisms in every civilized country which allow authorities to act without prior judicial authorization under exigent circumstances (when there is an immediate threat to life, for example).
They must be provide actual proof, and still it has to be signed my the actual police chief, which should count as "order" as well. They claimed there was none so that's why I'm curious.
if the dutch police pay the correct vat for the door-opening service, then dc will obediently open the front door. you can bet on it!
If there was legal basis, it would be very misleading for Windscribe side to say there was no warrant, even if it was a different kind of justified, legal police action.
I have also have serious doubts that any of the big Dutch datacenters they use would allow police to go in and out like that. I have trouble believing it.
Power corrupts. Rent-seekers is everywhere
https://xcancel.com/windscribecom/status/2019548861682085906
i think this is their first server seized since 2021 in ukraine. last time, there were private keys unencrypted on there, so im pretty interested to see how it plays out this time.
they recently had a greek court case where they provided no information, and if they can protect private keys during a server seizure, i think it will be one of the best vpns available.
Windscribe devops are highly incompetent as they were holding OpenVPN private keys for their infrastructure without any kind of security, in Ukraine, in the year 2021.
Plot twist: they were not actual Dutch Police, this is a new type of robbery to go after high RAM servers.
What does 512GB RAM go for these days?
That's pretty bad, probably amateur hour at the police department, usually they just get a port mirror set up instead so they can analyse your data before it touches the server anyway #nologgingisbullshitmarketing #vpnbeingsecureisfakenews