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1U Switzerland Colocation? - Page 2
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1U Switzerland Colocation?

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Comments

  • patrick7 said: UPC/Cablecom does not guarantee any speed. They say "up to 250 Mbps". You could get only 100 Mbps and they wouldn't care (see their overloaded peerings to Init7, they have packetloss and are informed about that since years and the only thing they say is "we are aware but we don't care")

    No, ask again - They guarantee you speed, in AT and eg. SK even fairly much... to the first hop, which always happens to be their network for obvious reasons. This is some interesting thing to avoid certain regulations.

    patrick7 said: I said YOUR link to the core is not overbooked

    Then let's fix that: The EDIS link is not overbooked and is dedicated to the core. It obviously still died when either PP/S or traffic killed Nine.

    patrick7 said: If you want to offer DDoS protection to your customers (and expect DDoS to appear)

    You are very naive, DDoS nowadays is daily occurrence even outside high risk things - having a few 10G additional are the LEAST you can do, sessions to filtering (in my case Staminus for first level/multi loc and another for single loc/extreme levels) are common.

    patrick7 said: That's true.

    It is not really for all; the Nine using space customers cannot be multihomed.

    patrick7 said: My statement that multihoming is possible @ colozueri.ch is still 100% true. colozueri.ch is carrier neutral since the facility has been opened

    ... and? Nearly any DC in DE/AT is carrier neutral and even if not you get at least 2 ISPs, i don't even see your point here. My flat is carrier neutral by fiber and DSL as well, by the full sense of the meaning.

    patrick7 said: It seems EDIS just does not meet the requirements if they use IP space from their upstreams

    You are LIR since when? Did you have a LIR before the last /8 came into effect? PA allocations from your ISP for multihoming were recommended and long time the default. @rds100 can tell you also and they are LIR since RIPE exists or so...

    patrick7 said: Where do they commit to deliver any DDoS to you?

    Oh, that's a good one - in the part about network neutrality, because i'm in EU and not CH. DDoS is traffic as any other, and no upstream i ever had failed to deliver DDoS below my port speed to me unless i signed for protection or other services like autonull before.

    patrick7 said: If you say "nine is shit because they don't let me announce their space"

    My only statement was before:

    I would not use Metanet; the network is not really good - just like Nine and Softplus/Sinavps.

    And my only further statement, on explicit request of issues was what you see above.

    I never explicitly said they are bad, just that i would not use them - this means weight of my word, what you make out of it is your problem, not mine (freedom of speech yada yada you get it).

    patrick7 said: If you announce a /22 v4 to your peer, and your peer only has partial table (example peering at any local IXP + default from transit). Now your customer announces the /24 out of that /22 somewhere else in the world. ALL traffic from your peer to that /24 will flow THROUGH YOU! If you do firewalling, RP_Filter or what ever, have fun!

    Yup, and it's not an issue - the traffic that arrives and has a correct path will be forwarded; i'm not sure what you think i run here lol - i do this since years and my setup (which offers me immediate hijacking options as well as upsell DDoS protection for customers with near zero config) works perfectly fine.

    The few Mbit additional traffic usage are absolutely not relevant (even if it hits in my Asian POPs) and realistically while what you said CAN happen it never does unless someone misconfigured something, for which i even send nice emails just like on weird route changes.

    We also feed data to multiple services you probably use for BGP monitoring (and half of the others here) and run our own monitoring service as well as public bgp.he.net clone and large LG well so... yea... i think i'm a bit ahead of you in that with a single LIR and a /22 with a 400CHF SwissIX Gbit port or so :')

    patrick7 said: Swisscom is maybe 0.1% better than Deutsche Telekom with their peering knowledge

    Sure, but this does not matter - Swisscom is what you use for enterprise; that is uncongested to CW and bank networks - for some gameserver, as i noted, this is not realistic to use. Same as you don't use Verisign or Neustar protection for your Minecraft unless you happen to be a billionaire.

    zeitgeist said: Not sure, I guess as a CEO he doesn't have to be competent in technical aspects, but back then everything he and his company did seemed rather amateurish to me.

    That might be, but it's the same as UPC in Austria and many of my other DC/Partners/Upstreams/whatever - good for a very specific use case, my job is just either to sell this actively or to get A+B together to cash out on either side (or both).

    patrick7 said: And that's the exact reason why william says Nine's network is shi*

    hehe, at this point you better come up with a solid quote from me for this, because Swiss law is not that different from Austrian and such things can get expensive very quickly.

    patrick7 said: By the way, the minimal contract duration for an inhouse patch in their datacenter is.... What wouuld you expect?..... 3 fucking years!

    The default contract term for most enterprise DCs is 5-10, especially in Asia (ask NTT or LG...) - 12-24 months are only common in Western and Eastern Europe.

  • @William said:
    1 - Are you in CH or EU? Importing hardware from outside EU to Switzerland without speaking German or French is a nightmare.

    2- Are you aware that you as non Swiss citizen (as well as all your users) WILL be monitored + traffic dumped by the Swiss government and have zero legal recourse against this?

    3- Do you have big budget? Because realistically CH costs you 50% premium to DE/AT on colo and 25-50% on BW. Less than 100CHF per U with minimal power and BW is not realistic.

    1. I'm in the US, so this sounds like it would be a hastle. Do they not speak English there?

    2. I did not know that and now makes me weary of doing a colo there. Do you have a source for that though? Interested in reading up on it.

    3. Something less than 100CHF would be more comfortable and I'm probably not going to colo there knowing how much it's going to cost now. Might as well go to Iceland, even they are cheaper in terms of space (BW very expensive though).

  • patrick7patrick7 Member, LIR

    Unfortunately it seems William is expecting everyone to agree with his opinion, otherwise he will start attacking people personally.

    This post will be my last one in this topic.

  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited November 2016

    patrick7 said: Unfortunately it seems William is expecting everyone to agree with his opinion, otherwise he will start attacking people personally.

    I'm still waiting to see where i said Nine is "shit" as you attributed the quote to me directly... Hm, using your laws (that your citizens or rather voting approved residents accepted after all) is now "personal", but i see - not an issue ;)

    patrick7 said: This post will be my last one in this topic.

    That is indeed very sad to hear.

    Lunar said: I'm in the US, so this sounds like it would be a hastle. Do they not speak English there?

    They do, Nine for example also handles import for you if you pay them (they did for us from EU which is a bit different with EFTA but not too much as the hardware has the same import codes after all) - It's just not cheap (about 10%, similar to the VAT rate in CH, cheaper than EU) and can take a while (week or so from EU, foreign bit more probably?), German speaking is highly advisable if you want to import yourself and fill the forms yourself (which are available for sure in German, French and Italian but not guaranteed in english).

    Lunar said: Do you have a source for that though? Interested in reading up on it.

    Mostly German, the newer law set:

    https://www.nachrichtendienstgesetz.ch/#faq

    This law was accepted by public vote on 25.09.2016, the old one already allowed very far access to foreigners though, constitutional protection seems to require at least a resident status.

    admin.ch (which is the gov website) seems down for me but this has the vote data and the content in english as well:

    https://www.admin.ch/gov/de/start/dokumentation/abstimmungen/20160925.html

    The law itself is available in English (or should be shortly) also on admin.ch in the legal documents section, either attached to something called StGB or "annex".

    I also have this cool story of the {unnamedISP}-Liechtenstein-AustrianGov triangle tapping a bunch of network ports (=my colo in LI) but that is for another time...

    Lunar said: Might as well go to Iceland, even they are cheaper in terms of space (BW very expensive though).

    Uh, well - yea, better legality wise but not as good influence wise as IS is not that independent regional. Advania/Thor have a nice DC and very cheap power plus server hardware is exempt from import taxes (from EU at least, US probably also, might have ended 01.2016), BW as you said about 3-5EUR/Mbit so not as cost effective as CH/EU.

    Maybe Norway? Terrahost has blackfriday offer today, an E3 for 39$ i think, and colo is around 100$ as well when i asked some months ago.

    Planning based on country is not too good either, you should plan based on needs on content (eg. porn will not fly in Iceland regardless of freedom of speech) and your location (being in China and hosting a Falun gong site in HK is a stupid idea).

    Plus consider also the thing @joepie91 would probably recommend, and what is anyway needed if criminal on enough level (so not warez) - Host anonymous and pay in BTC, but colo always has traces. Connect by Tor. Live on and prosper.

  • ascendrixascendrix Member
    edited November 2016

    @william and @lunar Regarding this:

    William said: Are you aware that you as non Swiss citizen (as well as all your users) WILL be monitored + traffic dumped by the Swiss government and have zero legal recourse against this?

    This is absolutely not accurate. The new law allows the Swiss Federal Government to monitor postal and electronic communication, the use of locating and monitoring equipment in non-public places, penetration into computer systems and networks, and the search of premises, vehicles or containers. These measures may only be applied in case of severe and concrete threats to Swiss national security such as terrorism, activity by a foreign intelligence agency in Switzerland, attacks on critical infrastructure etc. Additionally, applying these measures requires approval (for every individual case) by the Swiss Federal Administrative Court, the Head of the Federal Department of Defence, the Head of the Department of Foreign Affairs and the Head of Federal Department of Justice and Police. Additionally the government is required to inform the target of the surveillance 30 days after it ends.

    So there's no mass surveillance or bulk data collection. The new law is expected to enter into force on September, 1 2017

    Thanked by 1Scottsman
  • WilliamWilliam Member
    edited November 2016

    ascendrix said: This is absolutely not accurate

    Show me where your constitution protects foreigners... you are not EU member and thus this is the only binding (in AT/EU we also have the EU conventions as binding as these have "Verfassungsrang").

    This law also fixes some weird things that were ignored anyway; the old one for example did in practice not allow to tap cable links but only radio, most of it was done before by your external agencies anyway already.

    Snowden has proven you tap the UN in Geneva, trojaning PCs is legal even more so as in DE, MITM generally as well... yea, no, on paper your laws are FAR worse then the EU.

    ascendrix said: Additionally the government is required to inform the target of the surveillance 30 days after it ends.

    How do they inform unknown foreigners or eg. me? If they have no address or similar? This is semantics; they simply cannot.

    Outside of that this is pointless; if they are after you you cannot go to CH for a free trial either or get an independent juristical review.

    ascendrix said: These measures may only be applied in case of severe and concrete threats to Swiss national security such as terrorism, activity by a foreign intelligence agency in Switzerland, attacks on critical infrastructure etc

    Yes, the NSA has the same base, as does the BND, we have seen that this works totally fine :') Let me guess, the part of the Bundesrat that does this does it in secret due to "national security"? just like the BND and in the US? Yes, it does....

    The old law allowing trojans and wiretaps (which also says "Staasgefährdende Starftaten") has been used against eg. money laundry and drug dealing... where exactly is the "terrorism" here? The weed dealer in Bern finances Al-Qaeda in Switzerland?

    Viewed point by point, as done by eg. nachrichtendienstgesetz.ch this law is far worse than most of the EU, in some parts even the UK.

    Then ultimately CH's crux is here that it is... mostly... independent; EU you can always just continue until EU CoJ for review, CH you end at one point.

  • Maybe you lool at fsit.com they do have some nice deals

  • @xr_king28 said:
    Maybe you lool at fsit.com they do have some nice deals

    I would not recommend them. Tried one of the VPS - network speed was very limited. Their management GUI is buggy. And they store your root password (the one you choose when you sign up) in plaintext, as it is e-mailed to you when the VPS has been created.

  • xr_king28xr_king28 Member
    edited November 2016

    @zeitgeist said:

    @xr_king28 said:
    Maybe you lool at fsit.com they do have some nice deals

    I would not recommend them. Tried one of the VPS - network speed was very limited. Their management GUI is buggy. And they store your root password (the one you choose when you sign up) in plaintext, as it is e-mailed to you when the VPS has been created.

    Me in my case i have been a long time with them without any problem... so i dont know what experince you made. But what i am can say they are the best hoster for me and my services. i have got never an uptime like this

  • William said: But just so that everyone is happy we'll see once they deliver :)

    Hey William, did you ever get the VPS? Curious about your findings!

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