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If someone contacts another's employer and says "I just want them politely reminded" and goes on to say that they're a victim of sustained harassment and he feels threatened, it's pretty obvious what he wants. He is not stupid and surely knows that such a thing, if true and under the purview of the company, would be a fireable offense.
"Officer, I'm not asking for him to be arrested or anything, just politely reminded of the law, but this guy over here is smoking meth."
So we're allowed to interpret what WyvernCo"s intentions were but not Jar"s?
IMO that statement is just legal CYA. He wouldn't be talking to the General Counsel -- or anyone at the company at all -- if he didn't intend for someone to get fired.
No? Quite a lot of this thread has been about interpreting WyvernCo's intentions.
Given how he requested "inmediate termination" from Hetzner, it would be reasonable to guess he did the same with PayPal: request termination, not the removal of a sale or whatever, which we all know is something an upstream can not directly do anyway.
And the sale was a flash sale, so it was likely gone way before anyone at PayPal could act.
But I am done with this thread, it is insane, and I am ashamed to think I have spent multiple hours talking about this dumb, dumb shit. Good night.
Like I said, I do think that was an overreaction, but I don't see why that should lead to defense of jar's actions.
There's no reason to feel ashamed. Multiple people's reputations are on the line so it's completely fine to question people's stories.
Why? Please explain why MXRoute. I fail to see what MXRoute did to you.
Maybe it is best to address your issues with that person or against that person you have issues with, not against another legal entity which has employees, contracts, and hard working people behind it? MXRoute is a business which from what I gather did not cause you harm or prejudice. In my opinion maybe your issue is a person, not a business.
A more reasonable comparison would be, "Officer, that gentleman over there keeps calling me names and generally being a nuisance. I didn't want him arrested or anything but can you remind him of the law on this matter?"
all this debate is meaningless really. it only drains those involved and those who choose to read.
go for a walk/jog, swim/do sports or simply lift heavy. much better use of time.
Sure, and anyone who has dealt with (American) police would know that that would either lead to nothing at all or an arrest record for disturbing the peace.
I think you are right. My beef is with Jar, not anyone else at MXRoute (does anyone else work there?), and everyone on LET seems to like the company on a technical level. It might be a better solution for him to sell the company to someone else who can be a better front man.
Can I ask how often you've dealt with American police and in what sort of circumstances?
I've dealt with them often enough, but thankfully never as a target of their "investigations". My job (infosec related) brings me into contact with law enforcement types from time to time.
With all due respect, if this person isn't you, why do you care? You seem to be screaming about a few select things... I'm not saying jar was right, but you aren't in the right either. One things for sure, Biloh does know how to keep the high school vibes alive.
Next time you interact with your detective ask if you can talk to a beat cop. It'll blow your mind.
You'd be surprised. The most insufferable I've ever met have been federal investigators and DFIRs, not random cops. The entitlement is palpable.
There are two possibilities:
Neither is a great look to have on the forum IMO.
Honest question, because I do not know and am still on mobile: is it widely seen as illegal to post a promo code with someone's online forum username?
Honestly, seems to me like the escalation point was the Hetzner email. Jar should have taken a step away from the computer but you demanded termination of his account. That was a pretty big escalation in things. Did you ask LET moderation or admins to remove the offending sales coupon? Having non-nuclear attempts at its removal would have been seen less severe.
I honestly was (quietly) looking for a MXR alternative for production mail use when I read this thread and honestly thought there was a chance that Jar read your email, IDed you from it and then found your employer where he left a stupid review. But that was before I knew the rest of the context that was missing and what was conveniently originally left out. You took the coupon code with your username in it as a greenlight to try to destroy his business. You purposely left out the important details about trying to get hetzner to terminate his servers and PayPal. I think your offense to your username being used in a coupon code is grossly over exaggerated.
I think this matter could be settled with Jar donating the $20 or whatever he may have earned from his meme coupon code to a charity of your choice, even though your hetzner demand of termination causes him downtime which likely exceeded any sales made from a joke flash deal.
Again, my personal $0.02. Jar is hot headed and can be over dramatic, but to me (so far, based on what I've learned, but open to change of personal opinion with new facts) the clear escalation was when you took things to a new level by moving the drama off of LET and into the "Hetzner, PayPal, please destroy this family man's business" phase. If you didn't attempt to have LET remove the coupon, how can anyone argue your escalation was in good faith or a result of genuine concern of your username/likeness being used unjustly?
He did and he contacted the mods. There were a number of reports by a number of people.
lol welcome back. there's lots of opinions on that too though! We either haven't changed at all or we've reached new tiers of shit, depending.
Can someone give me a tldr?
No
WyvernCo and me got into an argument with jar. WyvernCo posted a link to the argument in one of his threads. Jar then created a flash sale titled "WyvernCo_and_forest_are_psychos". WyvernCo reported that to Hetzner as a breach of their ToS. Jar then tried to get WyvernCo fired/doxed him (but may have ended up doing it to an innocent person instead).
Now the only remaining discussion is the nuances, e.g. whether WyvernCo overreacted, whether what jar did legally constitutes doxing, who escalated more, etc.
That's good to know and important information. LET has a habbit of letting dumb drama continue because each click and page view is a measurable metric that looks good on a graph.
Would it have been acceptable to then escalate to Cloudflare or DigitalOcean where LET is hosted to have them remove LET, where the offensive promo code was shared? They failed to remove it when asked and when it was reported.
I don't think so, because it wasn't jbiloh who was posting it. LET was only the medium.
LOL don't get the banhammer
It seems the Reddit votes have stabilized after the bot votes were invalidated. Jar's post is sitting at roughly -105 rather than rapidly alternating between -15 and +15 on every refresh.
I could argue about it being a violation of my publicity rights, but that's not even required here since Hetzner doesn't allow their service to be used for insults, defamation, or derogatory statements. Profitting off of insulting someone else -- especially in the context of selling a direct product that includes their name -- is a very risky endeavor, and you cannot fault the upstream providers for not wanting to be involved in that.
Jar should not have done the attack sale, full stop. No buts, no caveats -- simply he should not have done it, and he has to own the consequences for doing it. Instead he kept doubling down, and people like you are enabling this behavior by coming to his defense.
Yes. Not that I had to, or I somehow owed it to Jar, but I both stated in the thread to stop the sale as well as contacted mods before proceeding.
I think you are just trying to rile me up so I get banned. I have some choice words about you and your insinuations about me.
I hope as many people as possible see your takes here, and they treat your business appropriately.
I literally said in my reddit summary that "I filed a complaint with his provider about this attack, which resulted in him briefly having a downtime and the sale was ended. So you can take your accusations of bad faith omissions and shove them.
Only good take you've had so far. I estimate it was more -- probably around $1000 IMO -- but yeah, I would like to see Jar donate it. I will find a charity if he wants to.
I truly think @MannDude is not actually trying to get you banned. There has been a lot of misinfo in here and it's understandable that he won't automatically side with you. But he's not the kind of person to try that. I think you're (understandably) very angry but it's making you perceive MannDude in a more negative way than you need to.