HostHatch - New non-sale pricing

darkimmortal

@TimboJones said:

@Daniel15 said:
Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

The gmail instant search results for 15GB of email appears as witchcraft to me. It's why I'll need to stick with gmail for my primary email for the foreseeable future. Anyone who's used Outlook desktop search will know searching sucks.

Thunderbird can give search results instantly for this amount of email

JasonM

@Daniel15 said: with AMD EPYC CPUs and Samsung Gen4 NVMe drives

even old plans seems to have NVMe ssd disks.. then why new plans have less storage, and that too 50% less storage?

fluffernutter

@JasonM said:
even old plans seems to have NVMe ssd disks.. then why new plans have less storage, and that too 50% less storage?

Extremely fast gen4 datacenter nvme is much more expensive than older gen3 stuff.

Daniel15

Thanks for the reply @hosthatch!

@hosthatch said: So instead we will build a high-performance pure NVMe block storage product, that you can attach to these VMs if you really do need more storage.

This would be awesome! I hope it ends up more affordable than DigitalOcean's SSD-based block storage ($0.10/GB/month).

@TimboJones said:

@Daniel15 said:
Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

The gmail instant search results for 15GB of email appears as witchcraft to me. It's why I'll need to stick with gmail for my primary email for the foreseeable future. Anyone who's used Outlook desktop search will know searching sucks.

Well, Google are a search company. I mean they're primarily an advertising company, but search is pretty high up there too. They index a huge amount of data, so 15GB is barely anything for them.

@darkimmortal said:

@TimboJones said:

@Daniel15 said:
Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

The gmail instant search results for 15GB of email appears as witchcraft to me. It's why I'll need to stick with gmail for my primary email for the foreseeable future. Anyone who's used Outlook desktop search will know searching sucks.

Thunderbird can give search results instantly for this amount of email

It's not exactly instant for me, but it's pretty fast (maybe 5 seconds or so)? Thunderbird indexes the entire account client-side and builds its own search index, so it's definitely also an option.

@LiliLabs said:

@JasonM said:
even old plans seems to have NVMe ssd disks.. then why new plans have less storage, and that too 50% less storage?

Extremely fast gen4 datacenter nvme is much more expensive than older gen3 stuff.

^ this

I bought a Samsung 980 Pro 2TB NVMe Gen4 drive when upgrading my PC in June last year and it was $400. The Gen3 drives were quite a bit cheaper. Looks like prices are dropping now though - The same drive is only $290 today.

stephfd21

@hosthatch so should we buy now or wait for BF?

pbx

@stephfd21 said: @hosthatch so should we buy now or wait for BF?

@hosthatch said: We also don't plan to do any crazy promotions for them (as was the case on BF21), as we've already priced them very well compared to what everyone else on the market offers.

szymonp

@TimboJones said:

@Daniel15 said:
Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

The gmail instant search results for 15GB of email appears as witchcraft to me. It's why I'll need to stick with gmail for my primary email for the foreseeable future. Anyone who's used Outlook desktop search will know searching sucks.

Outlook is fine if you use it with exchange (like office 365 ema hosting)

hosthatch

@JasonM said:

@Daniel15 said: with AMD EPYC CPUs and Samsung Gen4 NVMe drives

even old plans seems to have NVMe ssd disks.. then why new plans have less storage, and that too 50% less storage?

Depends on the way you look at it though.

Old plan:
1 CPU core, 4 GB RAM, 35 GB NVMe - $10 per month

New plan:
2 CPU cores, 8 GB RAM, 35 GB NVMe - $9 per month

So is it really half, though?

It won't make any sense for us to double the resources and halve the price at the same time. Naturally, we do not want to bankrupt ourselves.

We had someone once contact us to say it is not fair that we share these benchmarks on our site - https://hosthatch.com/benchmarks - because we should use the same specifications at all providers but.......why? We're simply sharing what we provide for $20 vs what other major providers do. We're not going to compare our $5 plan with someone's $20 plan just because its the same specs, that would be really stupid on our part.

TimboJones

@szymonp said:

@TimboJones said:

@Daniel15 said:
Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

The gmail instant search results for 15GB of email appears as witchcraft to me. It's why I'll need to stick with gmail for my primary email for the foreseeable future. Anyone who's used Outlook desktop search will know searching sucks.

Outlook is fine if you use it with exchange (like office 365 ema hosting)

I mean that it's bad for not returning search results with your one and only keyword. The number of times being on the phone with someone who says "I don't see it in the results" ...

But most recently, it's turning on the Focus inbox despite previously turning it off and thinking mail is missing for 20 minutes until cursing out the fucking stupid Focus option.

Daniel15

@hosthatch said: We had someone once contact us to say it is not fair that we share these benchmarks on our site - https://hosthatch.com/benchmarks - because we should use the same specifications at all providers but.......why? We're simply sharing what we provide for $20 vs what other major providers do. We're not going to compare our $5 plan with someone's $20 plan just because its the same specs, that would be really stupid on our part.

It'd be great to see updated benchmarks. 5 years is a long time in the tech industry and servers CPUs have improved quite a bit since the time the benchmarks were taken. Also some of the other providers in your comparison have "premium" VPSes with better performance now.

hosthatch

@Daniel15 said:

@hosthatch said: We had someone once contact us to say it is not fair that we share these benchmarks on our site - https://hosthatch.com/benchmarks - because we should use the same specifications at all providers but.......why? We're simply sharing what we provide for $20 vs what other major providers do. We're not going to compare our $5 plan with someone's $20 plan just because its the same specs, that would be really stupid on our part.

It'd be great to see updated benchmarks. 5 years is a long time in the tech industry and servers CPUs have improved quite a bit since the time the benchmarks were taken. Also some of the other providers in your comparison have "premium" VPSes with better performance now.

Yes, definitely going to be updated with our new website that will come out this week (fingers crossed)

Daniel15

@hosthatch said: this week

Got it - I'll check back in a month 😜

agentwp

Customers on regular monthly plans get better support or is it the same with promos?

hosthatch

@agentwp said:
Customers on regular monthly plans get better support or is it the same with promos?

For the moment, they get a higher priority, but we're working to provide equal support for everyone.

webcraft

@hosthatch said:
We're going to launch the new website soon, and then start migrating legacy customers into the new platform.

Is it just the new webinterface or new hardware as well?

hosthatch

@webcraft said:

@hosthatch said:
We're going to launch the new website soon, and then start migrating legacy customers into the new platform.

Is it just the new webinterface or new hardware as well?

Just the new web interface (but the VMs will no longer be managed by SolusVM, and we will offer all the features of the new platform - including true private networking, routed IPv6, snapshots, etc) on the legacy VMs.

You will have the option to move to one of the newer plans for a higher price.

TimboJones

@hosthatch said:

@Daniel15 said:

@hosthatch said: We had someone once contact us to say it is not fair that we share these benchmarks on our site - https://hosthatch.com/benchmarks - because we should use the same specifications at all providers but.......why? We're simply sharing what we provide for $20 vs what other major providers do. We're not going to compare our $5 plan with someone's $20 plan just because its the same specs, that would be really stupid on our part.

It'd be great to see updated benchmarks. 5 years is a long time in the tech industry and servers CPUs have improved quite a bit since the time the benchmarks were taken. Also some of the other providers in your comparison have "premium" VPSes with better performance now.

Yes, definitely going to be updated with our new website that will come out this week (fingers crossed)

Will get right on that, right after Chicago storage is fixed over a month later.

Daniel15

@hosthatch said: we will offer all the features of the new platform - including true private networking, routed IPv6, snapshots, etc) on the legacy VMs.

I was hoping this would happen! I remember you originally said that we'd have to wipe and reinstall to migrate to the new interface. Looking forward to having a private network between my old and new VMs in Los Angeles

gowrann

@hosthatch said: Just the new web interface (but the VMs will no longer be managed by SolusVM, and we will offer all the features of the new platform - including true private networking, routed IPv6, snapshots, etc) on the legacy VMs.

So snapshots will be soon offered? Can't see an option to include them currently when ordering a new service.

jsg

@Daniel15 said:

@hosthatch said: We had someone once contact us to say it is not fair that we share these benchmarks on our site - https://hosthatch.com/benchmarks - because we should use the same specifications at all providers but.......why? We're simply sharing what we provide for $20 vs what other major providers do. We're not going to compare our $5 plan with someone's $20 plan just because its the same specs, that would be really stupid on our part.

It'd be great to see updated benchmarks. 5 years is a long time in the tech industry and servers CPUs have improved quite a bit since the time the benchmarks were taken. Also some of the other providers in your comparison have "premium" VPSes with better performance now.

Maybe this is useful for you.
Run today on a cheap 2 vCores 2690v2 (3 GHz) promo VPS with NVMe in Norway, about 15 runs:

ProcMem MA:  519.6 MB/s (spread 91.8% - 110.6%)
ProcMem AES: 600.8 MB/s (spread 98.0% - 100.8%)
ProcMem RSA: 55.3 kp/s    (spread 89.9% - 107.2%)

Disk Read seq. 1MB blocks buf'd: 1354.85 MB/s (spread 86.6%- 106.6%)
Disk Write seq. 4KB/4T sync:        11.77 MB/s     (spread 72.7% - 119.8%)
                        IOps:        3013.74         (spread 72.8% - 119.9%)

Quite decent results for an E5-26xxv2. The good news is very nice consistency, low spread, the bad news is that crypto performance isn't great compared to AMD Zen.

As for the disk, well it's obviously not a current PCIe 4.0 high end beast but considering the kind of VPS we're talking about I'm very happy with what I get; also note the relatively low spread/decent consistency.

And here are some network results

US LAX: 67.1 Mb/s  (61.8% - 106.3%)
US NYC: 98.7 Mb/s  (84.2% - 111.1%)
SG SGP: 55.7 Mb/s  (95.1% - 103.7%)
CN HKG: 47.6 Mb/s  (95.4% - 103.9%)
DE FRA: 428.1 Mb/s (96.7% - 102.1%)
IT MIL: 203.5 Mb/s (86.8% - 108.6%)
RU MOS: 386.1 Mb/s (91.8% - 103.5%)

While those results are really decent (Hey, LAX over 50 Mb/s from Europe!) there's an ugly part, too: Most asian targets failed completely (except the two shown above). For me that's usually not a problem (I have VPS in Asia locations) but in case your project needs good Asia connectivity @hosthatch or at least their Norway location probably isn't a good choice.

Oh and keep in mind that the VPS I tested is a promo super-cheapy! 2 vCores, 8 GB memory, 40 GB NVMe and 20 TB traffic for $30/yr!

(As usual, please forgive my poor formatting skills)

Daniel15

@jsg said: Maybe this is useful for you.

Thanks. I meant the benchmarks on their site though. They show HostHatch as much faster than competitors like DigitalOcean, however the competitors have all upgraded their servers in the past 5 years, and the benchmarks were done with HostHatch's old servers rather than the new ones.

cazrz

@hosthatch
I wish that the new portal shows if the location is out of stock rather than showing the new server as pending then tickets takes long to get answered. So that you are not left wondering when will your order be delivered.

tarasis

@Daniel15 said:

@the_doctor said: Do you have any tips to get the IP reputation up?

I cheated 🤣 I relay outbound emails through MXRoute.

I already had a good Black Friday package for MXRoute. I set up a catchall account for each domain in MXRoute, then on my server I use Mailcow and configured each domain to use the relevant account for relaying. Inbound mail comes directly to me, while outbound email goes via MXRoute. It works great.

I would have used MXRoute but I have some specific requirements. My email account has ~400k emails in it. I need to clean it up at some point, but I do search through them to find old emails sometimes. Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

Oh, can I message you about your setup? I used to self host, then switched to MXRoute but I've been having issues with increased spam and legit emails I signed up to not making it through despite whitelisting the domain.

So I was thinking about self hosting the receiving again, and using MXRoute for outbound.

webcraft

Nice new website btw.

Ght

They dont offer DDoS Protection at all

Daniel15

@tarasis said:

@Daniel15 said:

@the_doctor said: Do you have any tips to get the IP reputation up?

I cheated 🤣 I relay outbound emails through MXRoute.

I already had a good Black Friday package for MXRoute. I set up a catchall account for each domain in MXRoute, then on my server I use Mailcow and configured each domain to use the relevant account for relaying. Inbound mail comes directly to me, while outbound email goes via MXRoute. It works great.

I would have used MXRoute but I have some specific requirements. My email account has ~400k emails in it. I need to clean it up at some point, but I do search through them to find old emails sometimes. Search on an account that size is just impossible without something like Solr (which MXRoute doesn't use). I used to have this account at MXRoute and tried their search but gave up after waiting a minute with no results.

Oh, can I message you about your setup? I used to self host, then switched to MXRoute but I've been having issues with increased spam and legit emails I signed up to not making it through despite whitelisting the domain.

So I was thinking about self hosting the receiving again, and using MXRoute for outbound.

Here you go: https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/178881/self-hosted-mailcow-relaying-through-mxroute/

webcraft

@Daniel15 said:

@hosthatch said: this week

Got it - I'll check back in a month 😜

It's today, one month later

Daniel15

@webcraft said:

@Daniel15 said:

@hosthatch said: this week

Got it - I'll check back in a month 😜

It's today, one month later

They're probably more focused on replacing the servers with the bad RAID cards at the moment, instead of the website

hennaboy

Their support is still pretty slow/unresponsive at times

Non-existent. Ticket submitted 24hrs later no response.

UK VPS with apparent performance issues where it simply ceases to function at random. The network has issues with bottlenecks occurring.

Clearly, they have infrastructure issues which in my opinion points to financial commitments poor hardware no staff.

aj_potc

I'm also seeing network speed issues at the London location (as well as ongoing issues with Chicago).

Several years ago, these locations worked great, and I rarely had trouble achieving impressive inbound and outbound speeds to servers on other networks. But something has definitely changed. Perhaps it's outside of HostHatch's control, but it significantly reduces the value I get from HostHatch if I'm unable to copy data to and from my backup locations at a reasonable speed.