Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!


US Police requesting IP address etc.. - Page 2
New on LowEndTalk? Please Register and read our Community Rules.

All new Registrations are manually reviewed and approved, so a short delay after registration may occur before your account becomes active.

US Police requesting IP address etc..

2»

Comments

  • solairesolaire Member

    Just give them a ring to confirm it's not a scam, then hand over the information as requested. If they want to do it the official way, they certainly won't come to you again but rather your hoster, and they'd just confiscate the servers harddisk, because that's way more convenient to do than asking you. Then your community is pissed, your hoster is pissed, and you could've simply avoided it by cooperating.

    Thanked by 1BlaZe
  • BlaZeBlaZe Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2019

    nvm

  • First-RootFirst-Root Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2019

    Make sure to follow your local (uk) law. I am pretty sure you are not allowed to provide personal data to any foreign police or agency.

    In your case I would contact a lawyer before making any decision and not listen to people you don't know.

    Thanked by 2Falzo FHR
  • WilliamWilliam Member

    deank said: Actually, I do think it's rather common.

    It is. I did abuse handling in all jobs until now and settled eg. with Austrian police on emailing PDFs with court/state attorney documents instead of the usual faxing which ends even with both sides digital like crap often.

    I generally want a document that at least alleges a crime (so at least the basic outline of what they say happened) in a language i speak (i.e. not French. They love that.). If the suspects data (if any) matches the customer data i confirm and possibly add what i have or give the payment details.

    Further i ignore certain countries entirely (some i have to) and set custom burden of proof on others (like US district attorney orders are not much worth or i'd never simply hand out eg. Georgian customer/other data to Russia/AZ) and disregard any legal system based on solely religious (especially muslim) law.

    It is a gamble and you need to decide often quickly but in most cases have no IMMEDIATE risk from an external agency if you decide to verify further, else they likely write no emails in the first place.

  • @muj said:
    I've just been contacted by email requesting IP address etc regarding a user on our site for investigation, how should I go about this as I'm from the UK.

    What does the data protection act say about this?

    Can I charge a fee? lol

    lol.

  • solairesolaire Member
    edited May 2019

    @FR_Michael said:
    Make sure to follow your local (uk) law. I am pretty sure you are not allowed to provide personal data to any foreign police or agency.

    In your case I would contact a lawyer before making any decision and not listen to people you don't know.

    Though I certainly agree with your from a hosting organization point of view, I don't think that is necessary here. You can obviously try, consult a lawyer, and do a thousand other things but the matter of fact is that communities like Reddit, 4chan and many others have tried the same thing to no avail. As a (hosting) company you're legally obliged to not just give away personal information, but for individuals like OP running a community, this is different. That's not to say he should just give it away and I reckon it is a rather grey area, but I just don't see the point in fighting it with absolutely no chances to win such case as OP has no legal ground but would just waste his own money on lawyers and the likes.

    Thanked by 2First-Root BlaZe
  • First-RootFirst-Root Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2019

    @solaire said:

    @FR_Michael said:
    Make sure to follow your local (uk) law. I am pretty sure you are not allowed to provide personal data to any foreign police or agency.

    In your case I would contact a lawyer before making any decision and not listen to people you don't know.

    Though I certainly agree with your from a hosting organization point of view, I don't think that is necessary here. You can obviously try, consult a lawyer, and do a thousand other things but the matter of fact is that communities like Reddit, 4chan and many others have tried the same thing to no avail. As a (hosting) company you're legally obliged to not just give away personal information, but for individuals like OP running a community, this is different. That's not to say he should just give it away and I reckon it is a rather grey area, but I just don't see the point in fighting it with absolutely no chances to win such case as OP has no legal ground but would just waste his own money on lawyers and the likes.

    It is not about fighting the police or do the "right thing" it is about avoiding doing the right thing and get fucked for it by local police. I don't know the laws in uk but I would spend the money for the lawyer just to be sure.

  • jordynegen11jordynegen11 Member
    edited May 2019

    We never rely on the email address. Especially when they asking for personal data.
    We always ask for extra identification like an ID or warrent (and call them).

    A police officer should always be able to identify himself. This also applies to online criminal investigation. If they don't or they say that's not possible, then we say: Ok, then we will not give you anything.

    Then there is always the question: Is de privacy of your customer more important then their case.

    Here in the Netherlands, privacy is generally more important and if they (for exemple) only downloaded a movie or uploading them, we are not going to give them any information.

    Also if they give you no reason or refusing to give you an reason, we don't cooperate as well.

    But if they identify themself and there is a good reason such as big scam, DDoS and high end fraud? We give them al information they want and free of charge.

    But in most cases they ask information about a customer that ordered a server 1 year ago. That is how the police works, always 1 year behind :wink:

  • tetechtetech Member

    GDPR may be applicable and if there is improper cross-border transfer of data you are potentially open to EU fines (although whether they actually come after some small guy is iffy). Look up cross-border transfer, privacy shield, etc. What does your GDPR privacy policy say - if it says that data may be transferred cross-border and given to law enforcement upon request, then your situation is probably different than if it says you don't share data full stop. If it worries you then consult a lawyer; part of what you pay for is less worry.

    Thanked by 1Falzo
  • BlaZeBlaZe Member, Host Rep
    edited May 2019

    nvm

  • SkanderSkander Member
    edited May 2019

    @BlaZe said:
    You all are missing the point that the user is not his "client" but a member of his online discussion forum community.

    As per what the OP has written, there seem to be no legal contract between the user & OP or OP isn't a service provider, providing service to the suspected user!

    Use some brains or read the main thread before replying.

    People just want to be mini-judges/lawyers and trying to fuck up the OP's situation.

    @muj,
    Do you have any legal contract/agreement with the suspected user? if not then just fucking help the police! The suspected user isn't your client or hasn't paid you for anything that you will fight on his behalf to safeguard his details (

    If the user is found guilty, he'll be trashed in jail, if not, then nothing -_-

    Why make it hard for the police?

    Forum members agree to a TOS and Privacy Policy outlining the use of the data that is being collected. They /are/ clients in that regard. Data protections apply.

    --

    Do not cooperate with anything other than a court order. Period. Processes exist for a reason.
    A courteous reply indicating this is a "nice" thing to do.

    Thanked by 3First-Root Falzo FHR
  • williewillie Member

    If this is really about swatting, that has caused several fatalities in the US. Usually because of trigger happy cops but still it is nasty. Way beyond downloading movies, ddos, or low level financial fraud.

  • WebProjectWebProject Host Rep, Veteran

    @FR_Michael said:
    Make sure to follow your local (uk) law. I am pretty sure you are not allowed to provide personal data to any foreign police or agency.

    In your case I would contact a lawyer before making any decision and not listen to people you don't know.

    Correct as anyone can pretend via email and request your customers personal information.

  • Nate812Nate812 Member

    @muj said:
    I've just been contacted by email requesting IP address etc regarding a user on our site for investigation, how should I go about this as I'm from the UK.

    What does the data protection act say about this?

    Can I charge a fee? lol

    If it's a court order in your country, you ought to comply. If it is not, you should write back that you are unable to provide the records requested without a valid court order as per your privacy policy.

  • defaultdefault Veteran

    Thanked by 2pike WebProject
  • jarjar Patron Provider, Top Host, Veteran
    edited May 2019

    I'm not a lawyer but I play one on TV. If a non-federal police agency in the US has reached out to you openly without proxy of your local/federal agency that has jurisdiction over you, they are reaching out in good faith and asking for a favor.

    I've been asked for a favor as a mere member of LET before, and extended the favor as it was both warranted and violated no privacy agreements (information I collected about a user through publicly available threads on the site, while I was a regular user and not admin). It was just that though: A favor. I had no obligation to assist. Neither do you.

    If you feel compelled to assist them, and it violates no law that you are responsible to uphold, that is your choice. If they believe that the situation is worth going through the proper channels, and they have the proper ability to do so, your government will reach out to you.

    Thanked by 1BlaZe
  • @Janevski said:
    Doesn't mean it's from the police, somebody could fake the mail.

    Anyhow, perhaps they should create a GUI interface using VisualBasic and see if they can track an IP address.

    Sometimes I wish I had zero knowledge of anything IT related, then I could maybe enjoy these shows.

    Once you understand this stuff, it becomes way too cringe

  • mujmuj Member

    @willie said:

    MikeA said: It's common for police to contact individuals who can help them with cases. They aren't the CIA after all. It's easier to work with people than go through court processes to get subpoenas and stuff.

    Hmm, that sounds a little weird, I'd be very dubious of an email from someone claiming to be the UK police. Is it at least a return address to a legitimate police agency? Is it email? Is there a phone number etc.? MikeA maybe you're right, I've never had to deal with anything like that, but it surprises me.

    https://nationalcrimeagency.gov.uk/contact-us/verify-an-nca-officer gives a phone number to verify NCA officers. Maybe OP could ask them to verify the US police request. The immediate concern is whether the request is genuine at all.

    Thanks for that, I phoned NCA they go if it was a genuine request they would go through Interpol and send a local officer around.

  • Can I charge a fee? lol

    Try it and let us know how that goes.

    Thanked by 1Nate812
  • @donli said:
    How do you know it's not a Nigerian Prince that contacted you by email?

    Best answer 😂😂😂

    Thanked by 1WebProject
  • WebProjectWebProject Host Rep, Veteran

    @donli said:
    How do you know it's not a Nigerian Prince that contacted you by email?

    I think they have run out of money as it was a several Nigerian princes and all of them wanted bank account in order to transfer some money :smile::smile::smile::smile:

  • Consult a lawyer. That's the only sensible, somewhat smart advice I can give.

    Don't know the laws, or practice in your country.

    In my country one would need a court order when giving out information, otherwise, they could be charged. And keep/store the court order for your protection, if the question of giving out info gets raised at any time later.

    So police can ask, but you mustn't give.

  • ChuckChuck Member

    lawyer costs money.

Sign In or Register to comment.