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Buying owned Windows Licenses - Page 2
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Buying owned Windows Licenses

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  • I've PMed @randvegeta this before but, a legit price comparing site (widely used in Germany) lists Windows Server 2016 ESD licenses for 1 PC from ~20€:

    https://www.idealo.de/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/5227917_-windows-server-2016-standard-24-kerne-en-oem-sb-microsoft.html

    It is quite well explained on
    https://teknologya.com/difference-between-the-oem-retail-and-esd-license/amp/ how ESD licenses (electronic dl/no disk) are cheap to get but generally one must also keep in mind the potential for abuse is quite high. An ESD license could be just from anywhere so it's important to find a trusted seller. Your key (especially if purchased via ebay) could be:

    • Taken from some education program and sold illegally.

    • Valid, but not meant to be sold.

    • Aquired using stolen CC details

    • Purchased in a region where Windows keys are sold cheaper than in Germany/US..

    .
    .
    .

    In all cases your key could be invalid from the beginning, or if you are lucky be valid and work for a while (or if you are lucky forever) and then suddenly be deactivated later (google "Windows: You might be a victim of software piracy" message). At the end of the day it's your bet to make. I wouldn't use it for business practices but if you want to use it for personal use you can give it a go. Not all licenses definitely are offered illegally. Technically your key could get deactivated multiple times and your could re-purchase quite often before you'd be losing money, assuming each one would last a year at least. From a german legal POV I'm pretty sure as someone mentioned earlier that these type of offers are legit (ofc not the illegal use case) in so far as that the (avg. non tech savy) buyer can not (easily) tell whether the offer he purchases is illegal or not. Idealo is a legit price comparing site and if purchasing through it, it also states "100% safe purchase bla bla", TrustedShop.. That said only the person offering the keys would be at risk if these are indeed illegal keys, theoretically. Practically if they are selling illegal keys they are probably sitting somewhere safe heaven. To be honest I once also bought my Windows 7 Key from a site which later got shutdown for dubious activity. The key kept working forever. At the point of purchase I wasn't as aware of all this circumstances mentioned above and a teenager though. Just saying, as an end-user my license never stopped working

    TL;DR: Your call. Private use probably okay (check with your country laws).

    Thanked by 1that_guy
  • @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.

    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.

    hides

    Thanked by 2eol MasonR
  • eoleol Member

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    Thanked by 1that_guy
  • @eol said:

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    You have to forgive him, he is from the 1980's and is probably doing cocaine like it is water.

    Thanked by 2that_guy TimboJones
  • @AuroraZ said:

    @eol said:

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    You have to forgive him, he is from the 1980's and is probably doing cocaine like it is water.

    I heard that Pulse became usable when Potterking stepped aside. Others had to fix it just so their Skype would work.

  • @Letzien said:

    @AuroraZ said:

    @eol said:

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    You have to forgive him, he is from the 1980's and is probably doing cocaine like it is water.

    I heard that Pulse became usable when Potterking stepped aside. Others had to fix it just so their Skype would work.

    That can't be true, Skype has never worked on Linux. At least my friend keeps yelling that in anger.

    Thanked by 1Letzien
  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Host Rep

    @hardgamers said:

    @randvegeta said:

    @qps said:

    randvegeta said: Surely end users are free to use their own licenses on a rented server?

    No, it is against the license agreement. If it is used on a hosted service, it must go through the SPLA.

    Seriously? So if I lease a dedicated server and provide IPMI, and the customer installs Windows on the server, this is not allowed? Presumably this is the end user who is going against the license agreement in this case.

    Microsoft have mobility license for their products, legally customer must have Enterprise license, software assurance and mobility license to use their license on provider server. But for the operating system, Microsoft have different terms :

    1. Windows server not eligible for mobility license, must be provided by authorized mobility partner ( SPLA is required to apply for authorized mobility partner ).

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/licensing/licensing-programs/software-assurance-license-mobility?activetab=software-assurance-license-mobility-pivot:primaryr2

    1. Windows 10, only windows 10 Enterprise e3 or e5 that allowed to use on cloud partner

    https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/deployment/windows-10-enterprise-e3-overview?ocid=tia-258213000

    All retail windows system only allowed to used on end user owned hardware, so even if end user RENT a dedicated server they are not allowed to use their retail license keys.

    If you have SPLA agreement with Microsoft and you are allowed your customer to violated Microsoft license agreement I SUSPECT Microsoft can take you to a court or at least stop the agreement, but you need to check this again with your Microsoft representative and re-read your partnership agreement with Microsoft.

    Technically almost every key will work, and of course any windows activator / hack also will works...

    If you do not renew the SPLA, then there is no agreement. And so it would not be reasonable that the host bare any responsibility or have any obligations at all. Must be down to the end user.

  • eoleol Member

    @TimboJones said:

    @Letzien said:

    @AuroraZ said:

    @eol said:

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    You have to forgive him, he is from the 1980's and is probably doing cocaine like it is water.

    I heard that Pulse became usable when Potterking stepped aside. Others had to fix it just so their Skype would work.

    That can't be true, Skype has never worked on Linux. At least my friend keeps yelling that in anger.

    I saw it working once.

  • randvegeta said: If you do not renew the SPLA, then there is no agreement. And so it would not be reasonable that the host bare any responsibility or have any obligations at all. Must be down to the end user.

    That isn't how Microsoft licensing works for server licenses in a DC. The end user can not obtain SPLA, the datacenter / hardware provider will need to provide the SPLA licenses as they are tied to the company providing the equipment if I recall correctly. So if your dream is to have no responsibility to Microsoft but allow end users to use their operating systems on your servers then your gonna have problems with that as that is not how SPLA works.

    In all cases with SPLA they hold the provider of the hardware and services responsible for enforcing the license agreement on their network / in their DC. That is why it is called a 'Service Provider Licensing Agreement".

    Cheers!

    Thanked by 1eol
  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Host Rep

    @TheLinuxBug said:

    randvegeta said: If you do not renew the SPLA, then there is no agreement. And so it would not be reasonable that the host bare any responsibility or have any obligations at all. Must be down to the end user.

    That isn't how Microsoft licensing works for server licenses in a DC. The end user can not obtain SPLA, the datacenter / hardware provider will need to provide the SPLA licenses as they are tied to the company providing the equipment if I recall correctly. So if your dream is to have no responsibility to Microsoft but allow end users to use their operating systems on your servers then your gonna have problems with that as that is not how SPLA works.

    In all cases with SPLA they hold the provider of the hardware and services responsible for enforcing the license agreement on their network / in their DC. That is why it is called a 'Service Provider Licensing Agreement".

    Cheers!

    That seems absurd. If we have no agreement with MS and do not provide Windows to our clients, and the client installs the OS themselves, in what universe does the host bear responsibility for their client's actions?

  • TheLinuxBugTheLinuxBug Member
    edited March 2019

    randvegeta said: That seems absurd. If we have no agreement with MS and do not provide Windows to our clients, and the client installs the OS themselves, in what universe does the host bear responsibility for their client's actions?

    Then they would need to buy full retail licensing and / or work out Licensing them selves with Microsoft before proceeding. Though normally in a DC setting this is handled by the DC / provider as it is MUCH cheaper to license through SPLA Than through fully licensing servers.

    All that said, I will default back to what @qps and @Clouvider said to begin with, if you are really concerned about this, you should contact your Microsoft representative for your business and discuss this with them directly. Only then will you fully understand the licensing terms and how they are handled for your business, your customers and even in your locality.

    Cheers!

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Host Rep

    @TheLinuxBug said:

    randvegeta said: That seems absurd. If we have no agreement with MS and do not provide Windows to our clients, and the client installs the OS themselves, in what universe does the host bear responsibility for their client's actions?

    Then they would need to buy full retail licensing and / or work out Licensing them selves with Microsoft before proceeding. Though normally in a DC setting this is handled by the DC / provider as it is MUCH cheaper to license through SPLA Than through fully licensing servers.

    All that said, I will default back to what @qps and @Clouvider said to begin with, if you are really concerned about this, you should contact your Microsoft representative for your business and discuss this with them directly. Only then will you fully understand the licensing terms and how they are handled for your business, your customers and even in your locality.

    Cheers!

    We currently have an SPLA and this is how our clients, for the most part, obtain their licenses. But like with almost every other service of which we are technically resellers (any kindof recurring license and domains), it just seems not worth the effort. Need to calculate if things actually cost more to run than the generate in revnue. If not, will either have to drop it or raise prices on those items until it makes financial sense.

  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Patron Provider

    But this is a simple calculation. I don't see any issues here.

    Numbers of cores * price per core * 1.X = $end Customer price

    X being your profit margin on the license.

    Chuck into WHMCS / whatever you're using and be done with it?
    Perhaps even generate a product report and see how many cores you've sold per SKU and do some auto-reporting from there?

    You don't want to try to go through the Microsoft audit, deployed at your expense, in accordance with the contract, to save a few $, not worth it.

  • randvegetarandvegeta Member, Host Rep

    @Clouvider said:
    But this is a simple calculation. I don't see any issues here.

    Numbers of cores * price per core * 1.X = $end Customer price

    X being your profit margin on the license.

    Chuck into WHMCS / whatever you're using and be done with it?
    Perhaps even generate a product report and see how many cores you've sold per SKU and do some auto-reporting from there?

    You don't want to try to go through the Microsoft audit, deployed at your expense, in accordance with the contract, to save a few $, not worth it.

    I dont want to deal with any 3rd party licenses at all. Wont be subject to an audit without an agreement in place. Ergo, no costs incurred if we just stop offering MS licenses.

    Its never as easy in the real world as planned.

  • @eol said:

    @TimboJones said:

    @Letzien said:

    @AuroraZ said:

    @eol said:

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    You have to forgive him, he is from the 1980's and is probably doing cocaine like it is water.

    I heard that Pulse became usable when Potterking stepped aside. Others had to fix it just so their Skype would work.

    That can't be true, Skype has never worked on Linux. At least my friend keeps yelling that in anger.

    I saw it working once.

    That was under TempleOS, not Linux.

    Thanked by 1eol
  • eoleol Member
    edited March 2019

    @Letzien said:

    @eol said:

    @TimboJones said:

    @Letzien said:

    @AuroraZ said:

    @eol said:

    @that_guy said:

    @eol said:
    I agree.
    But a real Linux ISO.
    No redhat/hatred infested poetteringOS crap.


    I kinda like systemd and pulseaudio.


    hides

    You can't run but you can hide.

    You have to forgive him, he is from the 1980's and is probably doing cocaine like it is water.

    I heard that Pulse became usable when Potterking stepped aside. Others had to fix it just so their Skype would work.

    That can't be true, Skype has never worked on Linux. At least my friend keeps yelling that in anger.

    I saw it working once.

    That was under TempleOS, not Linux.

    Now I remember...
    It must have been TempleOS 12.04.

    EDIT2:

    I mean Xubuntu.

  • That would probably have been Losethos, so you are forgiven.

  • @that_guy said:

    @Janevski said:

    @Letzien said:

    @SashkaPro said:
    Thats why Linux is a freedom.
    With Linux you have freedom of speech at least :wink:

    Not anymore.

    GNU/FreeBDSM.


    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/02/21/freebsd_code_of_conduct_controversy/
    Now stop talking to me without my explict consent, you're making me feel unsafe!

    BTW: At least in germany, those dirt cheap MS keys on ebay are ripped out of volume licenses. AFAIR a german or EU court ruled that legal somehow. And some sellers even claim they do that the 110% proper way in cooperation with some MS licensing experts, with certificates and whatnot. MS always says its still not allowed.
    IMHO: For business use, forget it. And for private use you might just as well download a linux ISO.

    The thing is Linux iso is sometimes very dangerous. You need to do the same shit every time you reinstall your pc. By using eBay license you got only valid serial number. There is no harm can be done by a bunch of number and string.

    Also I prefer to pay stranger $5 than and be done with it, rather than having to find Linux iso, go to shady website, download Linux Iso, and God knows what that iso contains.

    Using ISO from MS website, and using MS Serial makes your life much more simple. As long as the law doesn't say it's illegal, why should we give a fuck what MS says. Nobody above the law, including MS.

  • ClouviderClouvider Member, Patron Provider

    Erm, there were cases in court across Europe, where people using unreasonably cheap licenses from doubtious sources / like eBay for $5, were found to be at fault.

    So no, it’s not Microsoft who is somehow above the law, it’s you who know you’re pounding stolen software knowingly to try to game the system.

  • eoleol Member

    @yokowasis said:

    @that_guy said:

    @Janevski said:

    @Letzien said:

    @SashkaPro said:
    Thats why Linux is a freedom.
    With Linux you have freedom of speech at least :wink:

    Not anymore.

    GNU/FreeBDSM.


    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/02/21/freebsd_code_of_conduct_controversy/
    Now stop talking to me without my explict consent, you're making me feel unsafe!

    BTW: At least in germany, those dirt cheap MS keys on ebay are ripped out of volume licenses. AFAIR a german or EU court ruled that legal somehow. And some sellers even claim they do that the 110% proper way in cooperation with some MS licensing experts, with certificates and whatnot. MS always says its still not allowed.
    IMHO: For business use, forget it. And for private use you might just as well download a linux ISO.

    The thing is Linux iso is sometimes very dangerous. You need to do the same shit every time you reinstall your pc. By using eBay license you got only valid serial number. There is no harm can be done by a bunch of number and string.

    Also I prefer to pay stranger $5 than and be done with it, rather than having to find Linux iso, go to shady website, download Linux Iso, and God knows what that iso contains.

    Using ISO from MS website, and using MS Serial makes your life much more simple. As long as the law doesn't say it's illegal, why should we give a fuck what MS says. Nobody above the law, including MS.

  • @yokowasis said:

    @that_guy said:

    @Janevski said:

    @Letzien said:

    @SashkaPro said:
    Thats why Linux is a freedom.
    With Linux you have freedom of speech at least :wink:

    Not anymore.

    GNU/FreeBDSM.


    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/02/21/freebsd_code_of_conduct_controversy/
    Now stop talking to me without my explict consent, you're making me feel unsafe!

    BTW: At least in germany, those dirt cheap MS keys on ebay are ripped out of volume licenses. AFAIR a german or EU court ruled that legal somehow. And some sellers even claim they do that the 110% proper way in cooperation with some MS licensing experts, with certificates and whatnot. MS always says its still not allowed.
    IMHO: For business use, forget it. And for private use you might just as well download a linux ISO.

    The thing is Linux iso is sometimes very dangerous. You need to do the same shit every time you reinstall your pc. By using eBay license you got only valid serial number. There is no harm can be done by a bunch of number and string.

    Also I prefer to pay stranger $5 than and be done with it, rather than having to find Linux iso, go to shady website, download Linux Iso, and God knows what that iso contains.

    Using ISO from MS website, and using MS Serial makes your life much more simple. As long as the law doesn't say it's illegal, why should we give a fuck what MS says. Nobody above the law, including MS.

    Yeah, those shady Linux isos with provided hashes hosted on major CDNs and universities around the world. Super shady.

    Or did I miss that that post was meant to be a bizzaro joke?

    Thanked by 1eol
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