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You clearly haven't tested well enough.
List price, maybe... Juniper can be very competitive, especially if you push their butttons and start comparing against Cisco.
LOL. Well what kind of price would be realistic?
The specs of the MX104 looks pretty good, but $50k is no small sum of money. Especially if you need 2+ for redundancy.
how many traffic you will generate?
1x10Gbps and i have No packet loss (Yeah 0.3% at most) dropped
Plus minus the same as the ubiquity toy. x core tilera + y ports. Another glorified pimped up switch, albeit a little better designed it seems.
Also: Do not care about "aggregate throughput" and similar marketing numbers. Rather look at e.g. small pps and throughput.
Can be good enough for a company, particularly when using multiple units and resilience meaning "having a spare one in the closet" is good enough. For the DC though those are toys.
My pricing is under an NDA but I'd aim well below that.
They can be reasonable backup routers too to be fair. The claimed spec and actual spec are obviously not in alignment; but short of getting a DDoS attack, they probably work fine for normal traffic loads.
These enterprise routers seem to be running into the multiple 10s of thousands of dollars where as these cheap UBNT or MT routers are under 1K.
They are fun to play with in a lab, but why not as a backup too?
You mean in production of testing?
Testing, I'll try and generate as much traffic as I can and see just how much the router (or servers) can handle!
If in production, probably less than 500Mbit on any given port typical on average. Why?
The secret sauce to these software routers are userland network stacks like DPDK, PF_RING, Netmap and mTCP. DPDK can handle 12M pps per core on the fastpath (http://events.linuxfoundation.org/sites/events/files/slides/DPDK-Performance.pdf)
Don't know about BGP, but quite a few open-source virtual switches support userland networking (http://openvswitch.org/, https://github.com/bro/packet-bricks)
@randvegeta for this amount of traffic consider a Mikrotik. You can get a couple of these https://mikrotik.com/product/CCR1036-8G-2SplusEM that you can get at 836€ on interprojekt https://www.interprojekt.it/mikrotik/CCR1036-8G-2SEM
Or if you have budget you can have 72core tilera and 8 10ge ports with https://mikrotik.com/product/CCR1072-1G-8Splus . Price is about 1900€ https://www.interprojekt.it/mikrotik/CCR1072-1G-8S
ccr1072 is dual power hotswap and have good power. We manage these for some of out customers and can do 4-5Gbps line rate traffic with only 12% CPU usage. BGP is very stable and, with a proper tune you can absorb some little DDoS. When you go into production you can grab a DDoS Protected service from a company near you and you will be safe with a low budget, but good network.
These routers can be managed by console or winbox that is very user-friendly.
@matteob seems you have an awful lot of experience with them, but not enough to know their flaws.
That's what you run in house
?
Yes we use 19 of ccr1072 around europe in exchanges. These are devices that we own directly.
In addition we sell ip transit to lot of italian wisp and most of them use mikrotik. Some of them have management contract with us, so yes, we know a lot these devices, advantages and disavantages. We know their flaws and in some cases we found workarounds that was implemented in routeros releases.
Wow. You continue to surprise me. Running DDoS protection services on software routers in the core. Made my day.
And customers are happy, so we're not so bad as one competitor think :-)
I suggest to take a look on our architecture http://seflow.net/2/index.php/en/services/baremetalserver/securenetwork
and discover why work well AND WHY I NEVER SAID THAT WE RUN MIKROTIK ON CORE
You're not even a member of any of the non italian exchanges you say you are present at? (e.g. LINX)
Please check our network better and you will see why we have route control on these IXs
Could you elaborate?
Yes sure, please send me request to matteob [at] seflow [dot] net and i will get in touch.
Isn't it easier to just share with everyone? :-) We're all curious.
We're offtopic, please keep topic clean. If you need information about our network please send me request to matteob [at] seflow [dot] net and i will get in touch.
Amazing. A claim was made, challenged and a typical @matteob response executed. Why bother even starting the discussion if you don't intend to finish it.
Because we're offtopic, because you're a competitor so can't be unbiased, because some of our configuration are copyrighted and we need nda, because for some specific question we need to envolve our network architects, because to share some materials i need to be approved by marketing and because,again, this topic is related to a specific user question.
So if you need to be clarified to some points, please send me email and i will happy to give you any reply to your question and then you will be free to open new discussion on this forum and judge our structure.
Have nice day
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eh
Erm, you might think a lot of me, but Clouvider does not have any servers in Italy nor we deal with DDoS protection, so I wouldn't say we're competitors.
THN2 in Milan Docklands
I said that we have some mikrotik in IXs, this does not mean that are part of our core. Please it is not elegant see a competitor continue to try to put other companies in the wrong light, focus on your services.
I consider that discussione closed.
Have nice day
Waa Waaa. I got caught out. Waa Waaaaa. I'm butthurt
As @Clouvider mentioned, you should definitely spent enough time with Mikrotiks in non-productive environments first to get familiar with their flaws before you put them into critical environments.
However, those boxes can be quite neat and interesting, especially for LE-folks.
So it definitely can be an alternative compared to other well-known vendors.
But from my experience do not expect them to always work like one would expect if you already have some experience from other vendors. Especially their implementation of routing protocols can sometimes cause you headache. For example Mikrotik's BGP does not properly forward BGP routes if your border router is also running OSPF overriding the routes in the FIB. Never had problems with this on Cisco IOS, on Juniper JunOS it is configurable (advertise-inactive), and with MikroTik RouterOS it simply doesn't work. In 2015 I discussed this on the Mikrotik Forum (long story: https://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=82738&p=462528). In 2016 it was confirmed by Mikrotik support that this is a design flaw within RouterOS - and that they cannot fix it in RouterOS v6. In 2017 we are still waiting for v7 (since 2015). So let's see what will happen in 2018 maybe.
I guess every vendor, every OS, every box has its issue and limits somewhere. Just be sure to be aware of them, how to handle and work around it.
Yes the issue was caused by linux kernel and routeros use an old version. In newer version (on linux) it was full rewritten and work much better. This issue will be fixed when they will update the base kernel (if they will ever do). i think on next update of major version that i will not expect very soon.
For what it's worth: I think that Mikrotik has some reasonably decent products and that the 1072 is a decent piece of equipment - in the scenarios it's made for, which certainly isn't a DC (as i.a. the bgp problem clearly demonstrates).
While I personally don't like the routeros interface (neither cli nor win-gui) I see that it's a sufficient and simple interface for many admins who aren't hardcore network specialists.
And Mikrotiks boxen are usually quite nice, particularly for their price.
At the same time I fully understand when some providers smirk. Clearly, seen from a DC perspective the Mikrotik boxen are hardly more than toys.
In many companies, however, more than very simple routing is just not required and even some part of what an ISP needs can be perfectly well done with those boxes.
But - and that's a decisive point here: This thread was about a fully bgp capable router to connect some providers racks to the backbone and to possibly interconnect multiple DCs.
No matter how attractive the price would be and no matter how well the Mikrotiks perform a wide range of jobs, incl. some professional ones, they are clearly not what's needed here.
In case this thread is still relevant, and all the holy wars are settled you may check vyos community forum, as they lately discussed 10G Routers, routing performance testing and stuff. I decided to share additional info, may be someone will find it useful - https://forum.vyos.io/t/anyone-using-vyos-for-a-10g-router/4113/9