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RackNerd refused refund after ASN access issues — full timeline and resolution offered

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Comments

  • JabJabJabJab Veteran

    Try asking your LLM agent for even longer walls of text that says the same each time.
    Very helpful, much wow.

    Thanked by 1tentor
  • sharkgansharkgan Member

    The first thing that comes to mind is that you’re an "MJJ" [a member of the HostLoc community]. To be honest, RackNerd is a reasonable choice; perhaps you should look up their AS (Autonomous System) information online before deciding to make a purchase.

  • naveenlinnaveenlin Member

    @storycrafter said:
    So please help me understand. From my perspective, one practical suggestion, however feasible or not, is for @naveenlin to contact crunchyroll and openai and talk to someone in their IT side about exceptions or review of the block. Either ask to narrow the scope or carve out an exception or whitelist?

    But philosophically, if I, as a subscriber, subscribe to a VPS host whose networks have a history of causing bad things on the net such that the reputation of the network block is diminished, how is that not even a modicum of the provider's responsibility? It's their responsibility to police the traffic transiting their network, no? Presumably, they correct bad actors and ban them and the network's reputation is guarded. How is that reputation not the responsibility of the host operator? Isn't there an implicit assumption that if I'm purchasing both cpu resource and network transport resources that my packets will not be blocked due to the reputation of the provider?

    Or is it simply a matter of scope? The ASN encompasses more than just Racknerd in this case? If that's the case, doesn't Racknerd still bear the responsibility of coordinating with the peering network/datacenter operators to reduce the harm?

    (or whomever, I'm not trying to pick on Racknerd -- especially since I anticipate buying from them in just a few hours despite the possible reputational risk) ?

    Thanks — that’s a fair way of framing the network reputation question. I’m not claiming RackNerd directly caused the block, but I do think network reputation is relevant when evaluating the usability of a hosting network.

  • naveenlinnaveenlin Member

    @storycrafter said:
    So please help me understand. From my perspective, one practical suggestion, however feasible or not, is for @naveenlin to contact crunchyroll and openai and talk to someone in their IT side about exceptions or review of the block. Either ask to narrow the scope or carve out an exception or whitelist?

    But philosophically, if I, as a subscriber, subscribe to a VPS host whose networks have a history of causing bad things on the net such that the reputation of the network block is diminished, how is that not even a modicum of the provider's responsibility? It's their responsibility to police the traffic transiting their network, no? Presumably, they correct bad actors and ban them and the network's reputation is guarded. How is that reputation not the responsibility of the host operator? Isn't there an implicit assumption that if I'm purchasing both cpu resource and network transport resources that my packets will not be blocked due to the reputation of the provider?

    Or is it simply a matter of scope? The ASN encompasses more than just Racknerd in this case? If that's the case, doesn't Racknerd still bear the responsibility of coordinating with the peering network/datacenter operators to reduce the harm?

    (or whomever, I'm not trying to pick on Racknerd -- especially since I anticipate buying from them in just a few hours despite the possible reputational risk) ?

    Thanks, I think that’s a fair way to look at it.

    I agree that RackNerd cannot control what Crunchyroll or OpenAI chooses to block. I could contact those services, but realistically I don’t expect an individual VPS customer to be able to get an entire datacenter ASN whitelisted.

    The network reputation point is what I find more interesting.

    If I’m buying both compute and network connectivity from a hosting provider, I think it’s reasonable to expect the provider to care about the reputation of the networks they use and to work with their upstream/datacenter partners when that reputation becomes a problem.

    That doesn’t mean I think RackNerd directly caused the block or can guarantee access to every third-party service.

    In my particular case, the main reason I asked for a refund was simpler: I discovered the problem immediately after purchase and raised it on day one.

    So I see these as two separate questions:

    1. Who is technically responsible for the third-party block? Probably not RackNerd directly.
    2. Was a refund a reasonable customer-service response for a brand-new service reported as unsuitable on the first day? I think yes.

    And I do think the broader ASN/network reputation question is worth discussing separately.

  • storycrafterstorycrafter Member

    Thanks for clarifying about the fact that this was on the first day of obtaining the service. To my mind, that's all we can really do as consumers of these services -- buy them on speculation, essentially, and then immediately run some sort of validation on them once they're provisioned. I've only ever seen one host that actually allowed you free access to a VPS instance before purchase for a very, very limited time frame, presumably to run some validation.

    What it comes down to is if it's common practice for us to do our validation immediately after obtaining the service, then I suppose we rely on a provider's guarantee that if we find it doesn't work for our purpose or we find some issue that we are then allowed a refund. I just looked to see if RackNerd offers such a guarantee in this case, and find indeed, they do not. This is good to know going forward, as it does alter my plans to know that at least one LLM provider won't work from RackNerd's network. I suspect that will affect more and more people over time -- they may be surprised to find out their Hermes or OpenClaw won't work for particular configurations.

    Although I don't use either of the two services you've indicated are not accessible from RackNerd's hosts, the lack of even a 24 hour guarantee is a concerning for me as I do intend to eventually access other LLM providers for my use cases.

  • LEBUserJoeLEBUserJoe Member

    @xHosts said:

    @LEBUserJoe said:

    @xHosts said:
    Technically this is not Racknerds fault, the service they provide works but due to something outside of their control you want special treatment eg a refund.

    What would happen if you had the service 6 months and suddenly it had became blocked? Racknerds service is a cheap and cheerful service, if you need guarantees you are

    1)Check before you buy
    2)Go to a provider that will be giving you residential services but these will cost you a lot more

    Well at minimum they clearly got a certain clinetele getting entire ASN block by crunchyroll is impressive ngl, but OP should not expect any services to ever be connectable by any DC IP. all can be blocked easy.

    I run multiple site and autoblock all public proxies, and DC IP's not the provider fault.

    We had the same recently, Iran has been blocking certain networks / subnets due to the ongoing issues within the country, suddenly we get tickets of

    "change my IP now or give me refund" type of tickets, we test the servers, all fine, check from every other location, the servers can be accessed, have a stable ping these issues are beyond any providers control but the end result is a demand and if you do not do as they demand the tickets turn hostile, threats of chargebacks, posts on LET, getting added to a "shame" list for one country deciding to block the range / ASN.

    Once they connect to a VPN they can access their VPS again without issue.

    I had one person at the weekend send a ticket because of this type of issue, I was asleep, I have ping alerts on my personal phone for outages ect but business whatsapp on my business phone, I had 18 messages and 4 tickets from the same person with everything from a chargeback threat, bad reviews, reporting me to the the trading regulator to telling me I should be f**ked in jail for being a scam

    Their server was £8 a month, they had the server for 24 days of the month too

    Yeah no i'm with provider's on this in general nothing you can do, and even if you had another range that worked risking it being banned for those getting around restrictions is rough.

    I just think crunchyroll RARELY bans people its why i commented it's really impressive i wonder what got them banned i'd love to see the abuse notice

  • LEBUserJoeLEBUserJoe Member

    @naveenlin said:

    @dustinc said:
    Hi @naveenlin -- happy to clarify, and appreciate everyone who has chimed in and shared their perspective as well - as mentioned, providers unfortunately can't control how third party sites handle access. Some of these third party sites/platforms end up blanketing entire datacenter ASNs (not just ours) i.e. Netflix is a good example of this, as they block datacenter traffic along with anything they determine may be coming from a VPN, proxy, etc. This isn't something any hosting provider is able to control.

    As such, you'd likely run into this same issue elsewhere too. And even if not right away, it's often only a matter of time before whatever detection these sites use ends up classifying that traffic as coming from a datacenter network as well.

    With that being said, we're still happy to assist with any of the options we mentioned. Whenever you're ready to proceed, just update the ticket and we'll be happy to help :)

    Thanks Dustin. I don't disagree with the technical explanation, and I'm not claiming RackNerd caused Crunchyroll's block.

    I just want to clarify one important point that may not have been clear in my original post:

    I purchased the VPS, tested it immediately, discovered the issue immediately, and started requesting a refund on the very first day.

    This is not a case where I used the service for months and later asked RackNerd to absorb the cost because a third party changed its policy.

    Had I used the VPS normally for six months and then been blocked, I would not expect RackNerd to refund me.

    My disagreement is only about the customer-service decision in a day-one case. I understand RackNerd's policy and technical position; I simply think a $21.99 refund would have been a reasonable goodwill resolution when the issue was reported immediately after purchase.

    How? because your IP didnt connect to a few select services you didn't clarify before purchase that's on racknerd? Learn what proxy or VPN is you can use on your VPS!

  • PuDLeZPuDLeZ Member

    You guys, I paid for a taxi to take me to a club but the club denied me entry and now the taxi service won't refund me!

    Thanked by 5Saragoldfarb JasonM BasToTheMax tentor Docker_dude
  • johndeo983johndeo983 Member

    Bro really thought he could stream off a DC IP.
    What’s next, unlocking Netflix on a DigitalOcean droplet? Classic retard MJJ move

  • naveenlinnaveenlin Member

    @storycrafter said:
    Thanks for clarifying about the fact that this was on the first day of obtaining the service. To my mind, that's all we can really do as consumers of these services -- buy them on speculation, essentially, and then immediately run some sort of validation on them once they're provisioned. I've only ever seen one host that actually allowed you free access to a VPS instance before purchase for a very, very limited time frame, presumably to run some validation.

    What it comes down to is if it's common practice for us to do our validation immediately after obtaining the service, then I suppose we rely on a provider's guarantee that if we find it doesn't work for our purpose or we find some issue that we are then allowed a refund. I just looked to see if RackNerd offers such a guarantee in this case, and find indeed, they do not. This is good to know going forward, as it does alter my plans to know that at least one LLM provider won't work from RackNerd's network. I suspect that will affect more and more people over time -- they may be surprised to find out their Hermes or OpenClaw won't work for particular configurations.

    Although I don't use either of the two services you've indicated are not accessible from RackNerd's hosts, the lack of even a 24 hour guarantee is a concerning for me as I do intend to eventually access other LLM providers for my use cases.

    Thanks — that’s exactly the distinction I was trying to make.

    With VPS services, there often isn’t a realistic way to verify the assigned IP/ASN against every required service before provisioning. In my case I tested immediately, found the problem immediately, and raised it on day one.

    I also agree that the lack of even a short refund/testing window is useful information for future buyers, especially as more workloads depend on access to LLM and other third-party platforms.

  • LEBUserJoeLEBUserJoe Member

    @naveenlin said:

    @storycrafter said:
    Thanks for clarifying about the fact that this was on the first day of obtaining the service. To my mind, that's all we can really do as consumers of these services -- buy them on speculation, essentially, and then immediately run some sort of validation on them once they're provisioned. I've only ever seen one host that actually allowed you free access to a VPS instance before purchase for a very, very limited time frame, presumably to run some validation.

    What it comes down to is if it's common practice for us to do our validation immediately after obtaining the service, then I suppose we rely on a provider's guarantee that if we find it doesn't work for our purpose or we find some issue that we are then allowed a refund. I just looked to see if RackNerd offers such a guarantee in this case, and find indeed, they do not. This is good to know going forward, as it does alter my plans to know that at least one LLM provider won't work from RackNerd's network. I suspect that will affect more and more people over time -- they may be surprised to find out their Hermes or OpenClaw won't work for particular configurations.

    Although I don't use either of the two services you've indicated are not accessible from RackNerd's hosts, the lack of even a 24 hour guarantee is a concerning for me as I do intend to eventually access other LLM providers for my use cases.

    Thanks — that’s exactly the distinction I was trying to make.

    With VPS services, there often isn’t a realistic way to verify the assigned IP/ASN against every required service before provisioning. In my case I tested immediately, found the problem immediately, and raised it on day one.

    I also agree that the lack of even a short refund/testing window is useful information for future buyers, especially as more workloads depend on access to LLM and other third-party platforms.

    Did you really make a multi account, have a LLM agree with what you wrote previously, then double agree? XDDXDDXDX

  • naveenlinnaveenlin Member
    edited November 11

    @naveenlin said:
    Hi everyone,

    Update / clarification: One important part of the timeline was not clear enough in my original post:

    I purchased the VPS, tested it immediately, discovered the issue immediately, and started requesting a refund on the very first day.

    I am not claiming RackNerd caused the third-party block.

    My disagreement is about the customer-service decision in a day-one case. If I had used the VPS successfully for months and a third party later blocked the ASN, I would not expect RackNerd to refund me.

    In my case, the issue was discovered and reported immediately after purchase, which is why I believe a refund of the original $21.99 payment would have been a reasonable goodwill resolution.

  • fredo1664fredo1664 Member

    @naveenlin said:

    @storycrafter said:
    Thanks for clarifying about the fact that this was on the first day of obtaining the service. To my mind, that's all we can really do as consumers of these services -- buy them on speculation, essentially, and then immediately run some sort of validation on them once they're provisioned. I've only ever seen one host that actually allowed you free access to a VPS instance before purchase for a very, very limited time frame, presumably to run some validation.

    What it comes down to is if it's common practice for us to do our validation immediately after obtaining the service, then I suppose we rely on a provider's guarantee that if we find it doesn't work for our purpose or we find some issue that we are then allowed a refund. I just looked to see if RackNerd offers such a guarantee in this case, and find indeed, they do not. This is good to know going forward, as it does alter my plans to know that at least one LLM provider won't work from RackNerd's network. I suspect that will affect more and more people over time -- they may be surprised to find out their Hermes or OpenClaw won't work for particular configurations.

    Although I don't use either of the two services you've indicated are not accessible from RackNerd's hosts, the lack of even a 24 hour guarantee is a concerning for me as I do intend to eventually access other LLM providers for my use cases.

    Thanks — that’s exactly the distinction I was trying to make.

    With VPS services, there often isn’t a realistic way to verify the assigned IP/ASN against every required service before provisioning. In my case I tested immediately, found the problem immediately, and raised it on day one.

    I also agree that the lack of even a short refund/testing window is useful information for future buyers, especially as more workloads depend on access to LLM and other third-party platforms.

    Lowentalk, the website were AI can talk to AI without human interaction.

  • daviddavid Veteran

    Did you check their terms of service?

    " Refunds are issued on a case-by-case basis since by default no refunds are provided once payment is received."

    They were nice enough to offer account credit, though they didn't have to.

    But I understand, it was worth a try to ask. And they answered.

    Maligning Racknerd over something like this only makes you look bad.

  • JasonMJasonM Member

    @naveenlin said: I purchased the VPS, tested it immediately, discovered the issue immediately, and started requesting a refund on the very first day.

    you should have read their Terms of Service first. There are no refunds.
    if so, why ask? even if you didn't tested vps - just bought and asked refund the very next minute - still the ToS says no refund. They are giving an option for account-credit. go with it. no need to derail this thread anymore.

  • equalzequalz Member

    china warranty on purchases vs Western warranty on purchases, be aware when you buy outside of China, it's different

  • d2411d2411 Member

    Come on bro , it’s $20
    It isn’t even worth to complain about it.

  • TimboJonesTimboJones Member

    @naveenlin said:

    @naveenlin said:
    Hi everyone,

    Update / clarification: One important part of the timeline was not clear enough in my original post:

    I purchased the VPS, tested it immediately, discovered the issue immediately, and started requesting a refund on the very first day.

    I am not claiming RackNerd caused the third-party block.

    My disagreement is about the customer-service decision in a day-one case. If I had used the VPS successfully for months and a third party later blocked the ASN, I would not expect RackNerd to refund me.

    In my case, the issue was discovered and reported immediately after purchase, which is why I believe a refund of the original $21.99 payment would have been a reasonable goodwill resolution.

    Sure, but why would you expect a refund that was not advertised in any way? Why wouldn't you use a service with an advertised refund option?

    It's obvious to everyone but you. SMH

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