OpenVZ or KVM?

zhuanyi

So considering the server that I have won, which virtulization would you think would be better for me to start with? KVM or OpenVZ? I was originally planning for Xen PV but it seems most of the answers that I have heard so far are against Xen PV.

Already had some feedback from a few senior members, but just figured I should hear a bit more pros and cons in public.

Thanks people!

jhadley

Maybe you could tell us more about what direction you want to take with your new business?

zhuanyi

@jhadley said: more about what direction you want to take with your new business

Well, I won't compete for the cheapest VPS providers out there and the services will be largely unmanaged, price point will obviously be set in accordance to the platform used...is there anything else you'd like to know?

rsk

Hi,

If you want an easy to manage solution, I'd suggest openVZ - and once you get things rolling, then maybe get into KVM.

regards, R. Alkhaili

24khost

I would suggest openVZ to start. I am not sold on the KVM deal.

joepie91

I am not aware of any existing KVM providers currently hosting at ColoCrossing - so that may be worth a try, if you want to offer something unique :)

Raymii

Proxmox VE gives you best of both worlds.

miTgiB

@24khost said: I am not sold on the KVM deal.

What issues do you have with it, or is it all mental still?

@zhuanyi to achieve sustainability as fast as possible, which might not be a bad thing as you are on a limited timeframe, OpenVZ might be the answer.

miTgiB

@joepie91 said: I am not aware of any existing KVM providers currently hosting at ColoCrossing

BuyVM? They're are in Buffalo, is @zhuanyi planning Chicago?

24khost

So for openVZ on proxmox does it install the openvz container in a kvm?

zhuanyi

@miTgiB said: is @zhuanyi planning Chicago?

I think that is the location I am given.

zhuanyi

@Raymii said: Proxmox VE

I do not think the product is that stable yet...

Damian

I agree that for your initial services, you should go with OpenVZ. Expect that some people will complain about it, but it is what it is.

Offer KVM once you're up and going and making a profit. Don't bother with Xen, there's really no point anymore.

Zen

@24khost said: So for openVZ on proxmox does it install the openvz container in a kvm?

.....

@zhuanyi said: I do not think the product is that stable yet...

Insanely stable, much more than SolusVM or any other relatively cheap commercial panel. There's a reason BuyVM roll Debian.

craigb

@zhuanyi personally I prefer buying KVM (or Xen) and I expect to pay more. I don't know your technical skills and normally I'd say "go with what you know best" to get started with. But if you're looking to have someone else admin the node then I'd suggest going for KVM in Chicago as its less common. If you are the admin and you've never managed either, I'd say OpenVZ with a KVM chaser further down the line :).

hostdog

After using both openVZ and KVM I would not go back to openVZ. KVM is more isolated and the resources are guaranteed.

Corey

I would recommend KVM - you can sell windows VPS in addition to your linux VPS then :)

Corey

@hostdog said: resources are guaranteed.

lol?

Zen

As a client, many will prefer KVM/Xen because of the off-the-shelf appearance of guaranteed resources, but the truth is that all virtualization types can be oversold to some degree, and that overselling is not a bad thing. The chances of you actually not being given the resources you were promised in this industry is extremely rare.

On the other side, people don't look at the obvious advantages of OpenVZ like the ability to deploy servers extremely quickly and the ease of management, it is generally much more flexible. As a client you shouldn't write off OpenVZ straight away because of your own misinterpretations (like the overselling argument).

24khost

@Zen My question refers to the fact that proxmox can install both openvz and kvm, and from the way it read on the website on the same system. So i was asking if it installed the openvz container in a kvm like others have talked about doing here for backup purposes.

Chief

@24khost said: So i was asking if it installed the openvz container in a kvm like others have talked about doing here for backup purposes.

No, it creates both on the same host node. Allowing over-commitment of OpenVZ, and taking away KVM resources as allocated.

Zen

@24khost said: My question refers to the fact that proxmox can install both openvz and kvm, and from the way it read on the website on the same system. So i was asking if it installed the openvz container in a kvm like others have talked about doing here for backup purposes.

No it does not, not sure how it would do that either from a back-end point of view. It runs both KVM and OpenVZ with the option for both.

24khost

@Chief thanks. Okay, I was wondering. As I know that thrustvps used to have a reseller program that, the way I understand it used to install a Xen vps with openvz installed in it so that you could offer vps to your clients. Was wondering if it was the same idea.

Chief

@Zen said: No it does not, not sure how it would do that either from a back-end point of view.

Easy enough....

Install proxmox on the host node, create a KVM and install proxmox inside the KVM. Then cluster the two proxmox installs together ;) Then you could live migrate for example your OpenVZ's from the host node to inside the KVM :D

Other option for doing both virtualisations on the single node...

Install Solus/KVM on the host node, create a 8GB KVM.
Install Solus/OpenVZ inside the KVM.

Solus sees these as 2 separate nodes, you can now oversell the OpenVZ platform inside KVM, and you can sell standard KVM with allocated resources. It will require 2 licenses but there's a way without proxmox.

Clear as mud?

24khost

So theoretically possible, highly undersireable.

Chief

@24khost said: So theoretically possible, highly undersireable.

Which option is undesirable, and could you explain why...

24khost

the openvz inside kvm

Chief

@24khost said: the openvz inside kvm

Fair enough, but why would it be undesirable? You stated it was undesirable, I would like to know the reasons. Curious that's all.

Zen

@Chief said: Easy enough....

Install proxmox on the host node, create a KVM and install proxmox inside the KVM. Then cluster the two proxmox installs together ;) Then you could live migrate for example your OpenVZ's from the host node to inside the KVM :D

Other option for doing both virtualisations on the single node...

Install Solus/KVM on the host node, create a 8GB KVM. Install Solus/OpenVZ inside the KVM.

Solus sees these as 2 separate nodes, you can now oversell the OpenVZ platform inside KVM, and you can sell standard KVM with allocated resources. It will require 2 licenses but there's a way without proxmox.

Clear as mud?

Fully understand how it can be done manually as you explained, my comment was based on Proxmox doing this automatically.. (which @24khost implied) it would be a nightmare from a coding point of view to automate deployment of a KVM machine just so that you can deploy OpenVZ inside of that when you can just have them alongside each other and as you stated let the user do the above manually.

qhoster

KVM virtualization as you can run a lot more OSes. Like own dedicated server.

24khost

virtulization inside virtulization. Sounds like more trouble then it's worth.